http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=5987804&page=1

I remember when I was in Saudi Arabia during the first Gulf War, they had big signs outside the tent where they had the phones set up that said not to discuss any operational information when on the phones, as the lines were unsecure....
I'm pretty sure they listened in on the conversations to make sure nothing like that was discussed, and this was back in the 90's....

I remember when I was in Saudi Arabia during the first Gulf War, they had big signs outside the tent where they had the phones set up that said not to discuss any operational information when on the phones, as the lines were unsecure....
I'm pretty sure they listened in on the conversations to make sure nothing like that was discussed, and this was back in the 90's....

Well..being in the military in particular in a deployment to a hostile area I would full well expect that there is a high probability that my calls are monitored.

Other than that, going to, lets say Dubai or Beirut on a vacation or visit or even for work...I wouldn't expect or agree that my calls to home and family are monitored by the US government.

No, no argument there. However, a large portion of that article was dedicated to the monitoring of military personel's phone calls. If the Colonel's sex chat is being recorded, then it's only his own fault for engaging in it....

But if I'm a tourist, or a military official on my own time on a private line, stay the hell away.

But if I'm a tourist, or a military official on my own time on a private line, stay the hell away.

Except as member of the Armed Forces you are always on the govt dime....always

I wondered as I typed that. Chalk it up to us dumb civilians. As for the rest, the basic concept of privacy, that still stands.

I wondered as I typed that. Chalk it up to us dumb civilians. As for the rest, the basic concept of privacy, that still stands.
'

Oh I didn't mean to imply you were stupid by any means. Most folks aren't aware of the commitment you make when you take that oath is all ;)

Yeah it's called being owned by someone.

Wow, not proud of your service eh?

I was proud to serve my country, never thought of it as being owned.

Meh I'm damn proud of my service, but I have no delusions about Uncle Sam owning my ass. But I get plenty in return for my being owned.

That aside, if you're on a military installation you have consented to being monitored. Be it your internet traffic, you phone traffic, or just where you decide you want to walk/drive. It's kind of like implied consent, now civilians generally get a little more leeway when it comes to their privacy than military members. However if I was in a combat zone I would assume my conversations were being listened to, and I did whenever I called home. Because trust me, if Uncle Sam is listening, so is the enemy.

The big thing they're looking for is 1: People actively engaging in terrorism. and 2: Dumbass joes (and contractors) giving out operational security information. I believe the old addage was "Loose lips sink ships"

It's more true today than ever. That quick call before rolling out of the FOB, or that myspace bulletin saying "Hey I'm off to kill Haji" is nothing but intelligence for the enemy. And it's a good thing the military is looking after it, too much already gets out. And not just from a tactical standpoint. I sat down with one of our newer privates when I was deployed and showed him how I could open credit cards and steal his identity using just the stuff he posted on his myspace and a bit of google leg-work.

Getting back to my point, anyone that is shocked that the government is listening to conversations of everyone, including Americans coming from the middle east, especially out of combat zones, is still probably shocked that the sun rises each day.

Wow, not proud of your service eh?

I was proud to serve my country, never thought of it as being owned.

Not to diminish your service or anyone elses for that matter, but a soldier gives up their freedom, so technically you are owned as a soldier. Though without them there wouldn't be much freedom to go around.

Meh I'm damn proud of my service, but I have no delusions about Uncle Sam owning my ass. But I get plenty in return for my being owned.

That aside, if you're on a military installation you have consented to being monitored. Be it your internet traffic, you phone traffic, or just where you decide you want to walk/drive. It's kind of like implied consent, now civilians generally get a little more leeway when it comes to their privacy than military members. However if I was in a combat zone I would assume my conversations were being listened to, and I did whenever I called home. Because trust me, if Uncle Sam is listening, so is the enemy.

The big thing they're looking for is 1: People actively engaging in terrorism. and 2: Dumbass joes (and contractors) giving out operational security information. I believe the old addage was "Loose lips sink ships"

It's more true today than ever. That quick call before rolling out of the FOB, or that myspace bulletin saying "Hey I'm off to kill Haji" is nothing but intelligence for the enemy. And it's a good thing the military is looking after it, too much already gets out. And not just from a tactical standpoint. I sat down with one of our newer privates when I was deployed and showed him how I could open credit cards and steal his identity using just the stuff he posted on his myspace and a bit of google leg-work.

Getting back to my point, anyone that is shocked that the government is listening to conversations of everyone, including Americans coming from the middle east, especially out of combat zones, is still probably shocked that the sun rises each day.

I am still bothered by the fact that the people over there are so dehumanized to our military that they call anyone from the middle east a haji. One of the very sad instances of dehumanization and insulting behavior of our military I saw in a documentary.

I am still bothered by the fact that the people over there are so dehumanized to our military that they call anyone from the middle east a haji. One of the very sad instances of dehumanization and insulting behavior of our military I saw in a documentary.


Jedd my little friend you dont get it do you?

Today it's Haji! yesterday it was Charlie! before that it was Kraut,Nip,Jap, Slant eye etc.......

It's not racism or hatred at all. it a survival psychology. one that goes back to the Caananites and the Macedonians and Grog the guy who still has his teeth.

It's really all about 1 second!! because in a war zone any war zone!! 1 second is the differance between dinner or a coffin.

Dehumanizing the enemy is a not "bad' or "evil" thing. sometimes it's all you got! well that is if you wish to come out of a combat zone semi-sane! If I were given option #2, Fuck Haji!!!

Jedd my little friend you dont get it do you?

Today it's Haji! yesterday it was Charlie! before that it was Kraut,Nip,Jap, Slant eye etc.......

It's not racism or hatred at all. it a survival psychology. one that goes back to the Caananites and the Macedonians and Grog the guy who still has his teeth.

It's really all about 1 second!! because in a war zone any war zone!! 1 second is the differance between dinner or a coffin.

Dehumanizing the enemy is a not "bad' or "evil" thing. sometimes it's all you got! well that is if you wish to come out of a combat zone semi-sane! If I were given option #2, Fuck Haji!!!

From what I have seen they call Allies that are middle eastern Haji's as well... Maybe I just don't get it though, which is possible.

Wow, not proud of your service eh?

I was proud to serve my country, never thought of it as being owned.


Laughable...from an airwinger.

Not to diminish your service or anyone elses for that matter, but a soldier gives up their freedom, so technically you are owned as a soldier. Though without them there wouldn't be much freedom to go around.

How is that different from most other jobs, especially government? You are told where to be at certain times of your day, and what you are to be doing, and what behavior you can and cannot engage in, etc. It is only the last few years that the Hatch Act was loosened with federal employees, allowing them to support the candidate or party of their choice in a public manner. And with the decline in union representation in many workplaces, the employer is able to be even more demanding. An employee gives up his or her freedom; it may just be to what extent it is forfeit.

From what I have seen they call Allies that are middle eastern Haji's as well... Maybe I just don't get it though, which is possible.

Not all Caucasions in the Middle East are 'Crusaders' as well.

That sword cuts both ways, you know....

Well quit acting as though your service to your country was akin to slavery and I'll understand a bit more eh Rover?

Laughable...from an airwinger.

Says the jarhead....

Service is service, be ya a Squid, Grunt, Jarhead, or Airwinger.

I wish I woulda gone Air Farce, they have the nicest Barraks.... :D

How is that different from most other jobs, especially government? You are told where to be at certain times of your day, and what you are to be doing, and what behavior you can and cannot engage in, etc. It is only the last few years that the Hatch Act was loosened with federal employees, allowing them to support the candidate or party of their choice in a public manner. And with the decline in union representation in many workplaces, the employer is able to be even more demanding. An employee gives up his or her freedom; it may just be to what extent it is forfeit.

An employee can quit and go home at any time.

Not all Caucasions in the Middle East are 'Crusaders' as well.

That sword cuts both ways, you know....

Alright, since some random terrorist does it in the middle east it must be ok!

Alright, since some random terrorist does it in the middle east it must be ok!

And since some random guy in the military does it, it must be ok, as well?

It's not like there's a standing order from a General in the Armed Forces that says "All Middle Eastern men are to be referred as 'Hadji' from this point forward."

And since some random guy in the military does it, it must be ok, as well?

It's not like there's a standing order from a General in the Armed Forces that says "All Middle Eastern men are to be referred as 'Hadji' from this point forward."

Generals and officers not only do not discourage it's use, but use it as well...

Yeah, I heard General Tommy Franks refer to Middle Eastern men all the time as "Those Damned Towel Heads!"....:rolleyes:

Actually quite the contrary Jedd, we were repeatedly told in our "Culture briefings" to not call the locals Hajis. However bad habits are hard to break. And like they said, it just comes down to the current slang for the current war. It's not meant to be racist, it's just meant to be a label that's convenient, cause it's kind of hard for most of us Americans to tell the difference between a Syrian living in Iraq, versus an Iranian, or a jordanian, or a insert other random middle eastern country. It just works as a catch all name for them.

And besides isn't saying someone has completed their Hajj or however it's spelled in english a good thing?

In muslim/arabic culture a Hajji is a term of endearment. Unfortunately in wars people call other people name and they do it quite ignorantly ON BOTH/ALL SIDES.

Relax Jedd, using an improper term is the least of the problems in Iraq, anmd think of it this way; There's a whole bunch of muslims wandering around in Iraq thinking...HA...these idiots are clueless.