VA members are already being identified as "desireable recruiting fodder" and as such, recruiters from uberguilds on Tribunal have begun sending unsolicited tells to our members promising them their 72 virgins in heaven.

For information on how this might affect your uberguild, please contact Invictus Maneo (http://www.invictusmaneo.org/).

Lol Pali,
that should be a link for any guild that ponders the notion of mass stealing from another guild.with the lure of free loot and full membership overnight,no matter what your gear,levels,AAs or most importantly your skills and personality are.

it dont take a rocket scientist to figure out what type of folk your gettin with the get in free card.or the fun friction it causes those members that actually had to prove themselves for 2 months to get in.so you can imagine how they felt when "complete newb" walks in expecting handouts.

Don't feel too special, I logged in somebody's bazaar mule and it looks like anyone 65+ is up for a signing bonus :>

I'm holding out for a company car.

LOL @ Palimax
This merger thing might be the best entertainment these boards has seen in a while....*continues munching popcorn and cheering on the sidelines*

Make sure you check out the health benefits ....
:cool:

Personally I loose all respect for "Guilds" that do this sorta thing . My God you haven't moved to the serever yet and you ALREADY trying to do this?! Don't people get it the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

. . .some of us are just trying to see who we've been sharing the server with.

AND. . .maybe, just maybe, bring back the old, old Tribunal tradition of Gnomeball. . . .

Sotarr the Wizard, collector of Sotarr Kill Points

Guilds steal, its a fact of life. If people arent happy (for any reason, raids, attitudes, whatever) they will move on. Constant tells of loot and targets will shake a few people off of any tree if timed right.

How many EX VC you guys got Pali? =)

Course, we're used to being perceived as a stepping stone guild, so perhaps im biased. VC has gained members from below us too, no doubt, so please dont think I'm being a hypocrite, it happens at every level.

Kad

Speaking of ex VC....

Don't people get it the grass isn't always greener on the other side.

<grin>

Kad

Well I am sorry you feel that way Kad .. I was with VC for how many years .. 4 ?! I think I can not be claimed as part of using you all for a "stepping Stone" :(
But I still wish you all well and many are still considered friends
-Chelsi

Aw cmon Chelsi, you know we lub ya! You just happened to post at a very ironic time =)

cmon... throw some names out of these "uberguilds"...

I mean if you wanna start drama, why pull punches

I like people with some initiative :)

Maybe they are worried they might actually lose people? As i hear it, a few of the tribunal guilds are pretty far ahead of any on ayonae, so may be very desirable to people.

Well the Elitists just broke into anguish so they are ahead of rip.. but seeing a recruiter from that guild /ooc in the bazaar "high end guild looking for new players" then get in an argument with someone over them not being a liar about the server merge just cracks me up...

As a class captain from the Elitists guild I will go on the record saying that NO ONE was told to...or even encouraged...to do anything like that from the officers and captains. Captains are in charge of their own classes, and I would like to think that they are better than that...

If they were asking for 65+ it would be obvious no one from our guild as our level requirement is 70, no exceptions.

All guilds have their idiots, its really possible that one of these people thought it would be funny to do such.

I will say that SI and The Elitists are the top two guilds on our server and they both have a pretty good reputation (yes saying that about my #1 rival leaves a bad taste in my mouth, but I'll say it nonetheless!) ;)

Get used to it folks.

In the first few months we're all gonna see apps that can't buy a guild on their server apping to the cross server guilds and hoping the fact they are asshats wont be revealed.

We're going to see alot of "greener pastures" syndrome.

Guildhopping for a few folks will be rampant (a few of us in my guild are starting a pool!)

Then we'll have the bitching about time rotations among those in time guilds, some goat bitching about folks trying to equip new members and such, and a bit of racing to some non instanced mobs.

When the dust settles, it will work out.

Should make for some good NAGs though :p

I'll answer a couple of these:
How many EX VC you guys got Pali? =)I dont know Kad, but we've never directly solicited membership from your or any other guild.
Maybe they are worried they might actually lose people? As i hear it, a few of the tribunal guilds are pretty far ahead of any on ayonae, so may be very desirable to people.
Well, like I all my guildmates, so, I don't want to see any of them go, but I've always believed that the vast majority of VA members are in VA because they want to be, not because it's the best "deal" they can get out of the game in terms of rapid advancement.

WOOT - cross server flaming :) at least until the merge =P

Just to keep it even, how about the tells to people on Tribunal from AR players saying oooo join us when we come over ?

Hate to see such 1 sided things going on, we both have our drama I am sure, some not so nice players and then some very nice 1's....

Let's just see what happens with the merger, people make up thier own minds on where they want to play imo anyway. I am sure there will be alot of people moving about when it does happen no matter what.


Ummlaari Prideslayer
Enchantress of the Tribunal
The Death Squad

sorry double post http://ayonae.ro/images/smilies/redface.gif

As RiP's Recruitment officer i have zero intention of starting some lame ass recruiting thread on the trib boards or using targeted tells to try and snake some Tribunal players from their current guilds. Honestly, you're right, i think there is going to be some serious guild hopping in the near future. I feel we're pretty solid and before i start hitting tribunal players up for membership i'd like to have a pretty clear idea of who your server retards, douchebags, rejects and scammers are. But hey, you guys can go nuts trying to recruit A RO players. I'd make a list of Amazing players for you that we cut, booted, blacklisted and flat out would never allow to have our guild tag over their head. But go nuts and guild these clowns i'm sure they'll be giant ASSets to you and your mighty "ubah"guilds.

Yeah, it's going to be interesting. I'm absolutely 100% certain that two things will happen, (a) some of our members will move to a guild that came from The Tribunal; and (b) some people who came from The Tribunal will enter into our recruitment process.

The merger will no doubt cause butting of heads between guilds doing similar content, and will no doubt cause strife where, for the most part, it doesn't exist now.

I've always considered "poaching" to be a fairly craptastic way to recruit people, so I'm just ever-so-thrilled we're off to a great start.

Eh, they've got the right to I suppose. It's not like they can force your members into joining their guild, nor does any guild have the ability (or right) to force people to remain in its membership.

I was told that if I tried to leave my guild they would come kill my animals and burn my house down. Then they said that they would make me watch martha stewart shows while listening to Celion Dion and worst of all I owuld have to talk like a french canadian.


cerrio

Eh, they've got the right to I suppose. It's not like they can force your members into joining their guild, nor does any guild have the ability (or right) to force people to remain in its membership.Oh, sure, they're well within their rights to send all the tells they want. Doesn't make it any less shitty.

hahah yes Server wars.. Tribunal Drules and Ay Ro Rules! We should put a pull up and pick a server we really wanna go to and Everyone petition in for the free move. that would be pretty freaking funny.

EverQuest GM: Uh Sir we got a problem.
Supervisor: Whats the problem?
EverQuest GM: Seems Ayonae Ro isnt liking there merger, we are getting in alot of moving Petitions.
Supervisor: How many are petitioning?
EverQuest GM: looks like....................all of them.

so... about the names of these "uberguilds" ... ya know, the ones that are supposedly trying to steal your members?

cmon, we wanna laugh at them too... speak up.

I was never too bothered when so-called Uberguilds sent a wave of PM's to our guild members with promises of glory, heaven, and phatz0r lewtz0r. It used to usually sweep away the weak members we'd only have an inevitable problem with at a later date.

LandTurul went through a phase of doing it to the Jokers, was rather amusing. Speaks volumes of the kind of guilds they are.

so... about the names of these "uberguilds" ... ya know, the ones that are supposedly trying to steal your members?

cmon, we wanna laugh at them too... speak up.

hahaha won't happen some people just stir the pot in little tinsy waves and won't actually whip it. :cool:

As RiP's Recruitment officer i have zero intention of starting some lame ass recruiting thread on the trib boards or using targeted tells to try and snake some Tribunal players from their current guilds. Honestly, you're right, i think there is going to be some serious guild hopping in the near future. I feel we're pretty solid and before i start hitting tribunal players up for membership i'd like to have a pretty clear idea of who your server retards, douchebags, rejects and scammers are. But hey, you guys can go nuts trying to recruit A RO players. I'd make a list of Amazing players for you that we cut, booted, blacklisted and flat out would never allow to have our guild tag over their head. But go nuts and guild these clowns i'm sure they'll be giant ASSets to you and your mighty "ubah"guilds.
Actually, as a membership officer of Requiem my biggest worry about this merger is getting recruits we have absolutely no knowledge about. I've been involved with membership and screening out the stalkers, psychos, ninja looters, whiners, scammers, drama queens, ... for about 5 years.

The Tribunal has a lot of raiding guilds EP+. Many guilds are merging, joint raiding, or poaching members to keep going. 3 guilds have been attempting to take Requiem members recently. Frankly, our members are damn loyal so few have left and we have been growing. A lot of members are bringing in friends from defunct guilds.

I'd really be interested in the recruits we don't want info. Any membership officers interested in Tribunal trash can e-mail me in game, too.

Sounds like some talking needs to take place.

Heh Conjem, you just ruined my Fun. Those Tribunal guilds we hear are trying to recruit members unjustly, getting those "unguildable" people on the server, would have made it "all better."

anyone who jumps to another guild based upon cross server tell and not on researching the guild or learning about the options available deserves what they get. Period.


Funny how out of all those people (12 i think) who were lied to and recruited away to join IvM when they promised them time keys and gear, most are totally screwed because the guild is not what they expected and can't even raid the content effectively anymore.

Yup the grass CAN be greener but IS IT?

Funny how out of all those people (12 i think) who were lied to and recruited away to join IvM when they promised them time keys and gear, most are totally screwed because the guild is not what they expected and can't even raid the content effectively anymore.

Ok, I have been staying out of the flames for months but this one I need to respond too. Everyone that came over from VA got their time flag, well at least everyone that attended at least one time raid. Also if you look at the gear of the people that did come over they DID get tons of gear. I'm not going to single out names, but there were several that couldn't get epic help that now have it done, there are many that have substantial amounts of stuff they got from IvM(I'm not saying that this is all there is to EQ, but that seems to be the crux of your comment). Sure they aren't able to raid with ivm anymore, but most of them have even left the server, or went to "greener pastures." Very few went back to VA, so if that's the case, most of those members wouldn't have hung with VA anyhow. I want to know how any of them are screwed, anyone that wanted to go back to VA could, with more gear and a time flag. Many of the members that left VA are now in RIP, Landslide, or moved to the Nameless, that doesn't sound screwed to me.

Sure in the end, I gave up on ivm, but I was the last one to do so.

Here is a thread on The Tribunal site for names of folks they think we need to avoid. I came here just now to see if we have anything similar, but it has been a bit since I have looked at threads on the A-Ro boards (yes, it's true and sad). Anyone know if we have a thread yet to warn folks on Tribunal about the asstards on A-Ro that they soon will see (I am still looking, and may post this same thing elswhere, so try not to flam too hard ;) )?

http://p073.ezboard.com/fthetribunaldotorgfrm12.showMessage?topicID=2038.t opic

That was well said Taleren. As one of the VA members that went to IVM..I was not screwed. I was quite happy in IVM..for the most part the guild was full of friendly, knowledgable and entertaining people.

I, for one, was sorry to see it die....and now I sit unguilded, because I do not feel it is proper to return to a guild you left, and the others out there haven't sparked my interest. VA is alive and kicking with a very large group of players, so it needs to be put to rest I think

Also consider that probably in the next year or so, (or less) alot of these guilds bashing the others will be doing the same thing they are complaining about when their numbers start falling when newer and much better mmo's come out or when other much higher guilds start poaching their people.

Personally, i don't think EQ has more than a few years left till it just fades into the background as a standard mmo that only the diehards will frequent. Look at UO, DAoC, ect;. Five years ago, EQ was unstoppable, now they are merging servers and just trying to survive.
The Reign of the Uber-Guilds is over.....

I'm not going to single out names, but there were several that couldn't get epic help that now have it done

One of two things has happened. Either (a) you are full of shit, or (b) the person who told you that was full of shit.


VA handles Epic 1.5's by a first-ready first-served schedule.
VA schedules raid time on a regular basis to handle those requests, and uses "target taken" nights for Epic 1.5's outside of pre-scheduled nights.
VA provides DKP for assisting in thos raids.
Here's the actual VA Epic 1.5 schedule and completion list.
Completed Epic's 1.5


-- Bard Epic ---------+-- Druid Epic --------+-- Necromancer Epic --|-- Shadowknight Epic -|
______________________|DRU - Leyda___________|NEC - Aurom___________|SHD - Kadarya_________|
______________________|DRU - Furipodtoo______|NEC - Palimax_________|SHD - Maniacles_______|
______________________|DRU - Snaksize________|NEC - Khefka__________|SHD - Guthwolf________|
______________________|DRU - Pallin__________|NEC - Vaeder__________|______________________|
-- Beastlord Epic ----+-- Enchanter Epic ----+-- Paladin Epic ------+-- Shaman Epic -------|
BST - Zentrel_________|ENC - Artallen________|______________________|SHM - Retan___________|
BST - Gumbu___________|ENC - Shykia__________|______________________|SHM - Larlaana________|
BST - Growltom________|ENC - Clearurmind_____|______________________|SHM - Growlpuss_______|
BST - Koppercut_______|ENC - Dominoe_________|______________________|SHM - Morizard________|
______________________|______________________|____ __________________|SHM - Tarrek__________|
______________________|______________________|____ __________________|SHM - Nahual__________|
______________________|______________________|____ __________________|SHM - Waramen_________|
______________________|______________________|____ __________________|SHM - Coldog__________|
______________________|______________________|____ __________________|SHM - Keilch__________|
______________________|______________________|____ __________________|SHM - Claytin_________|
-- Berserker Epic ----+-- Magician Epic -----+-- Ranger Epic -------+-- Warrior Epic ------|
______________________|MAG - Utar____________|______________________|WAR - Feillan_________|
-- Cleric Epic -------+-- Monk Epic ---------|-- Rogue Epic --------|-- Wizard Epic -------|
CLR - Skolin__________|______________________|__________ ____________|WIZ - Batevil_________|
CLR - Arenia__________|______________________|__________ ____________|______________________|
CLR - Kalyca__________|______________________|__________ ____________|______________________|
CLR - Starliter_______|______________________|__________ ____________|______________________|





Requested Epic Raids
__________________________________________________ _____[Mar 15]
Date__Member___________Epic Zone____________Raid Size__90d Raid %

10/18__(MNK)Glencannon____PoJ 7th Hammer_________6-7 Groups_____1%
10/20_*(RNG)Buadyen_______Ruined City of Dranik__6-7 Groups____14%
10/22_*(SHM)Sorce_________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_______1%
11/07__(ROG)Riez__________Steamfont______________6 Groups_______1%
11/27_*(SHD)Carnival______Western Wastes_________5 Groups_______6%
12/30__(RNG)Elevon________Natimbi________________5-6 Groups____13%
01/15__(WAR)Kaelynai______Wall of Slaughter______2-3 Groups_____6%
01/17__(SHD)Fragtar_______Ruined City of Dranik__5-6 Groups____62%
01/22_*(NEC)Nevil_________Nobles Causeway________6-7 Groups____50%
01/25__(SHD)Nuuael________Dulak's Harbor_________3-4 Groups____14%
01/26__(MAG)Nemuneir______Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups____10%
02/01_*(RNG)Cheeta________Ruined City of Dranik__6-7 Groups____56%
02/03__(WIZ)Yandiarie_____Scarlet Desert_________7 Groups______54%
02/05__(MAG)Shortbob______Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups____12%
02/06_*(DRU)Iwikyla_______Kithicor Forest________4-5 Groups____38%
02/10__(BRD)Hawkai________Jagged Pines___________3-4 Groups____59%
02/13__(PAL)Kireg_________Plane of Storms________2-3 Groups____41%
02/13_*(MAG)Parthen_______Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups____37%
02/14__(MAG)Herbcast______Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups____36%
02/15__(MNK)Aack__________Harbringer's Spire_____3-4 Groups____37%
02/17__(MNK)Martoc________Harbringer's Spire_____3-4 Groups____68%
02/19__(PAL)Splashin______Plane of Hate__________4-5 Groups_____3%
02/21_*(DRU)Winfoo________Kithicor Forest________4-5 Groups____38%
02/27_*(SHM)Invizzigoth___Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_______5%
02/27__(RNG)Hador_________Bloodfields____________5-6 Groups____17%
03/01_*(WAR)Starslayer____Ruined City of Dranik__5-6 Groups____37%
03/02__(BST)Zekr__________Dranik Scar____________2-3 Groups____45%
03/05_*(PAL)Orun__________Wall of Slaughter______8 Groups______18%
03/09__(ROG)Ravynn________Abysmal Sea____________3 Groups______43%
03/14__(ENC)Laeyakk_______Siren's Grotto_________4-5 Groups____19%
03/15_*(MAG)Danille_______Nobles Causeway________5-6 Groups____26%
03/15__(BER)Vaprak________Sebilis________________3-4 Groups____19%
03/16__(MNK)Krakon________Harbringer's Spire_____3-4 Groups____51%
03/20__(MNK)Saiyian_______Harbringer's Spire_____3-4 Groups____24%
03/26_*(WIZ)Hrsepla_______Wall of Slaughter______10-11 Groups__29%
03/28__(NEC)Wirestromm____Barindu________________3-4 Groups____49%



Note: * = Final Fight to Complete Epic 1.5





Completed Epic Raids
Date__Member___________Epic Zone____________Raid Size__Status
10/06__(BST)Zentrel_______Ruined City of Dranik__4 Groups_____Done
10/06__(DRU)Furipodtoo____Ruined City of Dranik__4-5 Groups___Done
10/07__(SHM)Retan_________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/08__(DRU)Furipodtoo____Kithicor Forest________4-5 Groups___Done
10/06__(BST)Growltom______Ruined City of Dranik__4 Groups_____Done
10/06__(BST)Gumbu_________Ruined City of Dranik__4 Groups_____Done
10/13__(SHD)Kadarya_______Western Wastes_________??? Groups___Done
10/01__(RNG)Buadyen_______Bloodfields____________6-7 Groups___Done
10/08__(MAG)Teaerwen______Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups___Uncompleted/Retiring
10/06__(SHM)Growlpuss_____Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/06__(ENC)Clearurmind___Bloodfields____________3 Groups_____Done
10/05__(RNG)Jensae________Natimbi________________6-7 Groups___Done
10/19__(SHM)Tarrek________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/23__(NEC)Khefka________Noble's Causeway_______6-7 Groups___Done
10/22__(SHM)Morizard______Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/05__(RNG)Cheeta________Natimbi________________6-7 Groups___Done
10/09__(DRU)Leyda_________Kithicor_______________4-5 Groups___Done
10/31__(CLR)Arenia________Lesser Faydark_________4 Groups_____Done
10/31__(CLR)Kalyca________Lesser Faydark_________4 Groups_____Done
10/30__(WAR)Feillan_______Bloodfields____________5-6 Groups___Done
10/12__(DRU)Snaksize______Ruined City of Dranik__4-5 Groups___Done
10/08__(ROG)Niio__________Steamfont______________6 Groups_____Done
10/04__(BRD)Hawkai________Dragon Necropolis______4-5 Groups___Done
10/30_*(SHM)Waramen_______Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/30_*(SHM)Nahual________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/28__(CLR)Skolin________Lesser Faydark_________4 Groups_____Done
10/05__(RNG)Duuvyenx______Natimbi________________6-7 Groups___Uncompleted/Retiring
10/31_*(DRU)Snaksize______Kithicor Forest________4-5 Groups___Done
10/06__(SHD)Carnival______Ruined City of Dranik__5 Groups_____Done
10/26__(ENC)Clearurmind___Siren's Grotto_________4-5 Groups___Done
10/24__(RNG)Jensae________Bloodfields____________5-6 Groups___Done
10/10__(RNG)Tazith________Natimbi________________5-6 Groups___Uncompleted/Leaving Guild
11/22_*(RNG)Jensae________Ruined City of Dranik__6-7 Groups___Uncompleted/Retired
11/07_*(WAR)Feillan_______Ruined City of Dranik__5-6 Groups___Done
12/15_*(SHM)Coldog________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/29_*(SHM)Keilch________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
10/15_*(BST)Marshed_______Ruined City of Dranik__6-7 Groups___Uncompleted/Retired
11/09_*(CLR)Skolin________Wakening Lands_________6 Groups_____Done
11/03_*(CLR)Arenia________Wakening Lands_________6 Groups_____Done
11/19__(ENC)Clearurmind___Plane of Innovation____3-4 Groups___Done
11/07__(DRU)Pallin________Ruined City of Dranik__4-5 Groups___Done
10/30_*(BST)Koppercut_____Ruined City of Dranik__6-7 Groups___Done
10/18__(MNK)Ryusin________PoJ 7th Hammer_________3-4 Groups___Uncompleted/Retired
11/04__(ROG)Sulas_________Abysmal Sea____________3 Groups_____Uncompleted/Retired
11/04__(ROG)Niio__________Innoruuk's Fury________6 Groups_____Uncompleted/Retired
01/11_*(NEC)Vaeder________Noble's Causeway_______6-7 Groups___Done
01/09_*(DRU)Pallin________Kithicor Forest________4-5 Groups___Done
10/12__(MAG)Utar__________Plane of Tactics_______5-6 Groups___Done
10/03_*(WIZ)Batevil_______Wall of Slaughter______10-11 Groups_Done
01/15_*(ENC)Clearurmind___Plane of Mischief______6-7 Groups___Done
01/14__(PAL)Hombre________Vxed___________________4 Groups_____Uncompleted/Leaving Guild
10/27__(MNK)Krakon________PoJ 7th Hammer_________3-4 Groups___Done
12/16__(WAR)Starslayer____Bloodfields____________5-6 Groups___Done
11/02__(CLR)Starliter_____Lesser Faydark_________4 Groups_____Done
10/23__(PAL)Orun__________PoNightmare____________3 groups_____Done
11/03_*(CLR)Kalyca________Wakening Lands_________6 Groups_____Done
10/26__(RNG)Cheeta________Bloodfields____________5-6 Groups___Done
01/06__(DRU)Iwikyla_______Ruined City of Dranik__4-5 Groups___Done
11/05__(BRD)Hawkai________Dragon Necropolis(2)___6-8 Groups___Done
11/27_*(SHD)Maniacles_____Western Wastes_________5 Groups_____Done
01/17__(SHD)Mamadu________Dulak's Harbor_________3-4 Groups___Uncompleted/Leaving Guild
10/12__(MAG)Parthen_______Plane of Tactics_______5-6 Groups___Done
01/24__(ENC)Dominoe_______Plane of Innovation____3-4 Groups___Done
10/18__(MNK)Aack__________PoJ 7th Hammer_________6-7 Groups___Done
02/01__(MNK)Martoc________PoJ 7th Hammer_________6-7 Groups___Done
10/06_*(NEC)Liziardking___Noble's Causeway_______6-7 Groups___0% Feb 15 Removed
10/23__(PAL)Bradious______Vxed___________________4 Groups_____0% Feb 15 Removed
10/28__(BRD)Shara_________Dragon Necropolis______4-5 Groups___0% Feb 15 Removed
01/17__(SHD)Carackus______Dulak's Harbor_________3-4 Groups___Done
01/14__(DRU)Winfoo________Ruined City of Dranik__4-5 Groups___Done
10/08__(WIZ)Aeliena_______Scarlet Desert_________7 Groups_____0% Mar 1 Removed
10/08__(WIZ)Drobe_________Scarlet Desert_________7 Groups_____0% Mar 1 Removed
11/05__(RNG)Kdogg_________Natimbi________________5-6 Groups___0% Mar 1 Removed
01/21_*(SHD)Guthwolf______Western Wastes_________5-6 Groups___Done
10/08__(ENC)Laeyakk_______Plane of Mischief______6-7 Groups___Done
01/15_*(MAG)Utar__________Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups___Done
01/27__(PAL)Orun__________Vxed___________________4 groups_____Done
01/24_*(SHM)Claytin_______Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_____Done
01/23__(MAG)Danille_______Plane of Tactics_______5-6 Groups___Done
01/30_*(CLR)Starliter_____Wakening Lands_________6 Groups_____Done
11/04__(ROG)Lyeth_________Abysmal Sea____________3 Groups_____0% Mar 15 Removed
02/01__(MNK)Krakon________Bloodfields____________3-4 Groups___Done
02/05__(MNK)Saiyian_______PoJ 7th Hammer_________6-7 Groups___Done
02/06_*(ENC)Dominoe_______Plane of Mischief______6-7 Groups___Done
01/14__(WIZ)Hrsepla_______Scarlet Desert_________6-7 Groups___Done
01/31__(NEC)Wirestromm____Noble's Causeway_______6-7 Groups___Done
And, here's the actual April scheduled nights for Epic Raiding...apr 04 -------------------- EPICS from the list
apr 06 -------------------- EPICS from the list
apr 18 -------------------- EPICS from the list
apr 26 -------------------- EPICS from the list
apr 27 -------------------- Looking for elemental targets, PoFire,PoWater,PoAir, OOW Runes, EPICSAnd, as an added bonus, a quick count of the Epic 1.5 raids on the DKP server shows about 150 raids.

So, do tell. Are you full of shit, or is the person who lied to full of shit?

[Oh, the groups listed for the fight primarily exist to determine how much DKP to give, not necessarily how many people are actually needed nowadays.]

A quick final comment..

10/18__(MNK)Glencannon____PoJ 7th Hammer_________6-7 Groups_____1%
10/20_*(RNG)Buadyen_______Ruined City of Dranik__6-7 Groups____14%
10/22_*(SHM)Sorce_________Umbral Plains__________3 Groups_______1%
11/07__(ROG)Riez__________Steamfont______________6 Groups_______1%
11/27_*(SHD)Carnival______Western Wastes_________5 Groups_______6%
12/30__(RNG)Elevon________Natimbi________________5-6 Groups____13%
01/15__(WAR)Kaelynai______Wall of Slaughter______2-3 Groups_____6%
01/17__(SHD)Fragtar_______Ruined City of Dranik__5-6 Groups____62%
01/22_*(NEC)Nevil_________Nobles Causeway________6-7 Groups____50%
01/25__(SHD)Nuuael________Dulak's Harbor_________3-4 Groups____14%
01/26__(MAG)Nemuneir______Noble's Causeway_______5-6 Groups____10%People don't wait 3-4-5 months for an epic. These people mostly represent those with VERY low participation, or those MIA/AFK.

I'll notice that you have 0 completed Paladin(at least completed with VA, whether or not he's with the VA now or not is a moot point of who got it for him) or Warrior epics and leave it at that.

ok i messed up, i couldn't read your "table", you have 1 completed warrior epic.

Here's a list of people that got epics with us in the month -2 month stay from VA members, no it's not all inclusive because some of the epic raids don't list who completed them, but of the "12" members that came over from VA, a MINIMUM of 5 got epics, these are just the ones I have names for:

Zangal
Zentropa
Hombre
Bodybagg
Synphul(yes I know this one is actually debatable since she was an app to VA, or so I understand, at the time she came over)

Whoopity do, Bazil! What does it all mean?

Here's a list of people that got epics with us in the month -2 month stay from VA members, no it's not all inclusive because some of the epic raids don't list who completed them, but of the "12" members that came over from VA, a MINIMUM of 5 got epics, these are just the ones I have names for:

Zangal
Zentropa
Hombre
Bodybagg
Synphul(yes I know this one is actually debatable since she was an app to VA, or so I understand, at the time she came over)

Hey, thanks for that!

So, Taleran, what's the scoop then.I'm not going to single out names, but there were several that couldn't get epic help that now have it done You're telling me they COULDN'T get help in VA. If they told you that, they lied, or if you're telling me that, you're lying. So, what is it?

Well, I tell you... I quit playing (again) months and months ago... not long after that expansion came out, and I am little over halfway done with my 1.5.

It's not really that people can't get the help in VA, it's that people worked harder to get the help before them and they may have to wait. Some people get mad about having to wait, fairly, in line.

Two of the people on that list told me that they couldn't get the help that they needed in va, that they'd been waiting months, etc. One of those 2 is back with VA now that he got the help he wanted with his epic.

Well, I guess those people misrepresented "couldn't get help" now didn't they - and you seemed pretty happy to repeat it, didn't you.

so it goes from me lying, to that person lying, to now since that person is back in VA, they were simply "misrepresenting" the situation?

The simple fact is, there is more to doing the epics than raids, there are many classes that need group events, or a couple group events to get through it. Sure they may have been eventually able to get help for the raids, but not until they got the lesser help they needed, and I really don't think they were lying about not being able to get that help. I will still point to the fact that VA has gotten 0 paladin epics on their own to point that out.

Whether we are here arguing semantics or not, I didn't come here to argue why or who we got epics for but rather came here to make a point that no one that came over to IvM got "screwed." I'm not here denying that we tried to "poach" some members from VA, because we did. I'm here saying that NONE of those members were EVER screwed by IvM(though many longer term IvM members DID get screwed by where we put the VA in the loot hierarchy). They were new members and still got all the epic help they needed, in a timely manner. They got their time flag. Most of them that weren't over 66-67 are now level 70. They got tons of gear for the time they put into IvM. They got to see things that they wouldn't have otherwise gotten to see for months. All of these point away from them being screwed.

Starting as a full member from day one, getting loot over long term members from day one, getting epic help before some longer term members, getting a time flag their first raid with IvM, etc., points AWAY from being screwed. I would venture to say that most of them feel they were treated VERY WELL during their time with IvM.

I'm not here denying that we tried to "poach" some members from VA, because we did. I'm here saying that NONE of those members were EVER screwed by IvMOh, see, there's the rub. I've never suggested those members got screwed by IvM. Everything I've heard suggests that they were treated well. I'm just saying what I've been saying all along. It didn't work out quite as well for the uberguild as they had hoped it would.

That's the moral of this story kids, the one Taleren missed - when you're looking to poach members from another guild behind their backs while negotiating with them for merger/absorption/assistance/joint-raiding to their face - things might not work out as nicely as you had hoped.

I will still point to the fact that VA has gotten 0 paladin epics on their own to point that out.

What, exactly, is your point?

Did you ever think that maybe the Paladins of VA don't push too hard to get their epics? For the most part, the Paladins of VA are adults who have been playing the game for a very long time, off and on. We, for the most part, just go with the flow. *shrug*

I just really don't understand why you're making a bigger deal about VA's Paladin epics than......VA's Paladins.

I didn't start this conversation to discuss even what you said prior in the thread Palimax, when I started in this discussion, if you'd look at what I quoted, I was debunking what Danille said. As far as not working out for the uberguild, sure in the long run it didn't work out, but it did keep us raiding easily another month that we wouldn't have been able to raid had it not happened.

As far as my point to the paladin epic Bradious, you are selectively reading posts apparently if you think my intent ever was to make a big deal out of the paladin epics, its your guild leader that childishly came here calling me a liar when he has no clue. Yes I was integral in getting VA people to join IvM, but I guarantee you, those members wouldn't call me a liar, or that I lied to them. One thing I am NOT is a liar. I'd rather Pali come here and spout obscenities my way then call me a liar. The example about the paladin epic is stating that yes the paladin that's in VA now, told me specifically he couldn't get help on his epic when he was in VA. Does that make ME a liar? fuck no it doesn't. Does that make him a liar? I don't think so, I still believe that he wasn't able to get the smaller group help that he needed in VA.

I don't care what you think i'm missing the point about, but one thing I do care about is when clueless people make baseless claims that IvM treated ANY guildmates unfairly, or "screwed" anyone that joined us from VA. I DO care when someone that's not privvy to every conversation calls me a Liar, when that is also baseless. I know you derive your jollies in saying things to people that you wouldn't IRL pali, I've been one to stay out of petty, immature things on this board up til about now, you thrive in causing conflict here, I'll let that stand on its own to any outsider reading this lame ass attempt at a flame of my character, or my guild.

The part about openly poaching member from VA was a sufficient insight into your character and your guild for me to form an opinion. Your assassination is a result of your own choices, not the resulting comments of others.

Knowing the deterioration of your guild at the time, where you honest during your unsavory recruitment? Did you inform these new people that they were being recruited so that you and yours could continue to enjoy the treasures of the game in a fashion to which you are accustomed? You can't honestly expect one to believe that they received epic help because you wanted to help them, lets face it, you were helping yourself ~ just in a roundabout way. Because you were openly poaching members from other guilds, your colours are predetermined to disallow any claim to be offering any genuine generosity.

Greed is the downfall of most, be it a 30hp falter or a 20k death trip.

You made the statement that someone in VA couldn't get help with an epic. That statement is untrue (which I've demonstrated). You're either repeating someone elses lie, or making up your own. If you think I wouldn't tell you that in person, or if you think that I'm correcting your "mistake" because I thive on drama, you're foolish.

Poaching is done by every guild in this server. It may not be as openly as others, but it is done. VA isn't innocent in this regard, nor is RiP or others...If you say you don't, then your just kidding yourself. It may not be as blatantly obvious as IvM or others did but its there.
Anyhow, why worry? IvM is pretty much not around anymore. Neither is LS and a host of others that can ruin your playtime. The one thing i don't get is that the guilds who never said much when the others were on top are now the ones going down that same road and having the same attitudes they railed against.
Going to have a ton of guilds going against each other and at least 3-4 euro guilds pretty soon and i have no doubt they won't have any qualms about luring away people from the former Aro guilds.
Just my 2 cp...

I can't think of a single occasion where VA sent an unsolicited tell to poach members from another guild. We just don't do it cause Palimax would have our nuts if we did.

Depends how you define poaching. And how you define unsolicited. Certainly people within VC have been 'courted' by any number of guilds (including VA) by people who either pick up grouped with them or were friends with them prior to their own leaving for that next guild. In some ways its flattering that they think enough of our members to try to steal them. Cant really get mad at other guilds for trying or even succeeding, either you keep your folks happy or those tempting offers are accepted.

Kad

I'm certain that on numerous occasions that members of VA have extoled the virtues of our little slice of heaven to people they group with; but "/who all VC 69-70 /tell <vcmember> Hi, are you happy with your guild, we're recruiting" isn't our style.

Every guild on the server is full of members of some other guild. Well, not me, but that's another story.

Dont wanna blow your guy's minds or anything but I got one Phrase that will put this all into perspective..............











ITS ONLY A GAME.

<a Hush combs over the crowd>

ITS ONLY A GAME.Blasphemy!

ITS ONLY A GAME.

<a Hush combs over the crowd>

What?! Well shit, you're right. Nearly six years in the MMORPG world, and never before have I contemplated that last letter in the acronym. Simply brilliant!

I've probably heard that said about seven thousand times by now, but this time, it really stuck. Such clarity! Such insight! The online gaming community will surely hold you up as its messiah.

Sure, it's only a game.

But if you're going to play? Play to win, or don't bother....

Fandros

ITS ONLY A GAME.

<a Hush combs over the crowd>

Combs over the crowd? (http://www.totallyabsurd.com/comboverpics.htm)

I didn't know all MMORPG players were balding men....

Depends how you define poaching. And how you define unsolicited. Certainly people within VC have been 'courted' by any number of guilds (including VA) by people who either pick up grouped with them or were friends with them prior to their own leaving for that next guild.

Very true. I guess how I define poaching is by sending recruitment tells out of the blue to people you don't actually play with, don't really know except possibly by public reputation and have no prior relationship with (in or out of game) based completely on their level/AAs, gear, raiding percentage, etc.

I define unsolicited exactly as it is defined... as not requested or inquired about by the target. If someone asks you "so tell me about your guild", that is what I consider a solicited opportunity to recruit. If the subject doesn't come up, but you suddenly say "come join xxx guild, we'll give you better opportunities for advancment", that is unsolicited.

Talking to a long time grouping buddy who happens to wear another tag or even a RL friend or relative comes more under my definition of networking. If you include networking as poaching, then yes all guilds do it because lets face it, friends want to play together and they aren't always in the same guild.

What Palimax is complaining about are guild members getting tells sent to them out of the blue by people they don't even know to join xxx guild, i.e. unsolicited blind recruitment. Cold calling if you want to use the term. VA doesn't do that to the best of my knowledge.


* As an aside, mention of the lack of VA paladin epics was made earlier in the thread. That situation is really more of a symptom of the paladin epic 1.0. As you know, having the original epic is a shorter path to epic 1.5. Back when epic 1.0s were all the rage, paladin epics were put on low priority since they really didn't benefit the guild as a whole compared to say the cleric or enchanter epics. Add in some really annoying chokepoints and pain-in-the-ass turn in spots (PoSky and Fear), it was pretty tough to get help on 1.0. Soon weapons better than the pally epic were available in expansions so few of us ever actually completed it. Now that 1.5 is worthwhile, we are working on getting caught up again. When you are in a guild with 100+ people all wanting help on epics and who *each* require an average of 3 raids, it's gonna take a while to get everyone taken care of. We have one pally awaiting his last fight to complete 1.5 on the list. The rest of us are plugging along, waiting our turn.

BTW, that pally thats in VA now.....lets call him a "black-knight" for obvious reasons. He started to do his 1.0+1.5 only a few weeks before he went for IVM. A guild cant drop everything to get him his epic. Vice versa him complaining about not getting help(which he did). I was their helping him finish 1.0 and several parts for 1.5. He did get help, he just was trying to rush it without allowing the way VA gets epics to come to his turn for a battle.

I appreciate that Deviant, I feel your comments show I wasn't lying about this.

VA poaching? that will be the day the real would ends.as long as ive known pali and the some of the other officers there,going all the way back to our vision days.there were only two things vision/VA did to releive the down times when normal recruiting didnt work.they either talked with another guild to do joint raids(exiled alliance etc..) or they would talk to another guild that was in the same boat to do a full merger(aka Vallis scortor) and/or absorb whats left of an already dead guild(wolf pack,AP etc...).

none of the leadership there had ever conspired or acted on some kind of policy to poach from other guilds, with promises of loot and other pixlated crap.that is the key word "leadership",it was never about a couple members here and there goin about on there own while in exp groups.tryin to lure some people to come over to there guild.its about the actual leadership all agreeing this is what guild policy is gonna be.they are, afterall the face and voice of the guild.

I agree completely. I'm certain there was no concentrated efforts, that any crossovers were either for people who wanted more constant raiding than we do, people following friends over, or for people who werent happy with us anyway. What I allude to is having heard second hand of such and such member linking specific loots rotting or individuals inviting people that they had grouped with to 'check us out', not any kind of organized effort. And like I said, there is no dishonor in that and it happens at every level of guild.

Kad

Oddly enough this very thing seems to occur at the mid level guilds just as frequently. Faithful Legacy is infamous for it. Hopefully they will read this thread and see how much it's frowned upon, if they didn't already get the jist from a NAG thread last month. ;)

Erm, the point here is NOT that it's frowned on.
The point here is that it's ineffective.

Either way.
It's not cool nor is it effective.

*picking his snout*....oh good geawd...........it appears that some people like to take this WAAAAAAAAY out in the field,and let it ferment for a long time. ;)


It's like this......(old toilet humor) "If it's yellow..let it mellow...if it's brown...flush it down.....me?....i like shit stew!" :p


People need to be calm about it,and just let the idiots go off and get burned. "The mellow-out way"

Or....

People can take action and burn them for thier own pleasure inguild. "The Burn-out effect"

Me?....personaly.......go ape-shitthefuckcoocoo and mark a few hundred trees in the most dangerfilled zone,and moooooo all day long in PoK(Parkinglot of K-Mart). "The SHIT STEW effect" :p

I still fail to see what's so immoral about this. It's not like someone can "steal" something that nobody can own.

Immoral? No (unless done in the midst of negotiations, thats called bargaining in bad faith). Annoying? Yes. It's like telemarketing. There's nothing immoral about it but it sure pisses you off.

exactly Gulor, that sums it up nicely.

No one said it was immoral, that is a word of your own choosing. I personally think it's bad form.

/shrug

If you're getting frustrated by someone calling you on the phone, you're overlooking an extremely simple solution: hang up. If you get to the point where you're pissed off, it means you didn't hang up quickly enough.

Roliel, post your phone number please. :)

DAMN!
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Palimax Sceleris again."
:D

I would like to mention of the list of folks you mentioned, Telaren...

Zangal - VA App (VA for less than a month)
Zentropa - SoH merger (VA for around a month...maybe a little longer)
Hombre - Full Member in long standing (left about 2-3 months after 1.5's came out)
Bodybagg - SoH merger (VA for less than a month)
Synphul - VA App (VA for less than a month)

In fact...the status of the folks IvM got from us was:

Active VA members: 3
Inactive VA members: 1
Ebay'd VA members: 1
VA Applicants: 3
SoH members: 12

These were all folks recruited while we were in talks with you about a possible merger between the two guilds. When that didn't pan out, IvM handed out free passes for any VA member who wanted to jump ship (many of these folks were way under IvM's class requirements), and the above are what they got.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kadath...both Vallis Scortor and Vision aspects of our guild completely understand what you guys are going through...which is why we would never intentionally/officially go mining for VC members...which is what IvM did to us. I, personally, remember how crappy it was when our members went to SoT/EW...esp in Vallis Scortor...it seemed like these guilds were targetting us because they knew we worked hard to let in only good people (there's always some boners that slip in...but generally =). The deal with the VC members coming over was done by networking/individuals...not as a targetted recruiting scheme by management. No VC got a free pass to VA.

People dont always leave for greener pastures sometimes its your friends that make you want to go. Believe me I loved VC BUT when all my "friends" left and headed over what was I to do ?! They make my game fun & interesting to say the least .
My point was the ones that do leave for greener pastures most of the time find out its not always greener. You only get what you put into something.

Rememeber, the grass is always greener where the dog shits the most.

Rememeber, the grass is always greener where the dog shits the most.

Huh. My dog's shit seems to kill the grass.

Active VA members: 3
Inactive VA members: 1
Ebay'd VA members: 1
VA Applicants: 3
SoH members: 12That's not a stat that I'm proud of. The former-SoH members existed with a "Main:SoH" tag for a few weeks after the merger for some minor merger stipulations (no guildbank access for the first few weeks, etc). They're all listed as "Main" in the guildmanager now.

They're just my brothers from a different mother :)

I miss Sect, it was a good guild :(

LOL.. hehehe eh eh heh eh eheh ehe eh eh
V.A> let Deepconcern in =P
Sect was a good guild til Ebon found a god complex .. =P

Roliel, post your phone number please.

Well, the only way you'd manage to annoy me is if you were to repeatedly call, which is a bit different than the scenario we're talking about (unless I missed it somewhere; I don't think harassment has been brought up with regards to this issue). ;) Granted, I don't usually pick up unless it's somebody I know...

Because Ebon ( you I think) took a great idea and perverted it.. raid targets became "targets that had loot that Ebon wanted" . "Ebon" drove away most of his officer core then talks about how HE built SoH up...LOL ... God forbid you had an issue... became a personal attack. blah blah blah and so forth .. Not worth going on.. and I heard you were back. LOL .. cracks me up..
as far as e-bayed toons .. who cares how someone got a toon.. just care how they play and act.

In all the time I was in SoH I never felt that Ebon had a "god complex" or that he picked and chose targets as you say. He was a good guild leader and I feel had RL not been such a bitch to him SoH would have gotten RZ eventually not to mention the guild would probably still be around :( That was the downfall of the guild, that and other new games on the horizon. People like me either gave up or went somewhere else that they could thing done....or they went to a guild that started by people who got tired of raiding PoP targets.

Wow I didn't know I was so popular :-) Wish I knew who you were. I never said I didn't have some accounts bought or taken over from friends. I three box it is a fact. I have leveled accounts and sold or gave them away to friends over the last 6 years I have played Everquest. Never said I didn't. Now with that cleared up let's move to the SOH issue.

Fact is Myself or anyone else who left SOH never had any issues with SOH. We had a long talk with Ebonknight before we left and explained the direction he was taking SOH was not the direction we wanted to go. He said it was cool and we left on what we thought good terms. We even said if he needed any help on anything we would be happy to come out. The reason we left was an officer actions were supported by Ebonknight and we told him that we felt if we couldn't respect the leaders leading us then we felt it best not to be led by them.

Less than a week later Ebonknight began telling SOH they were not allowed to group with us or be friends with us, etc. etc. Being we had friends inSOH still officers and members word got to us quick. When Ebon was approached he lied about it. Then after we left he began doing nothing but ZERG encounters on RZTW and that my friend is why people began leaving SOH.

Yes we did start a guild and we were doing OLD World only = No competition for SOH on any targets. We even offered people to help on SOH raids when you guys were short and EBON refused the help. Remember one raid had you taken on the 15 we offered you might have succeeded. The reason SOH fell apart and pretty much dissolved was Ebonknights poor leadership and the fact he was blinded by getting his RZTW Flag.

We did a joint encounter and succeeded on RZTW on third attempt something SOH never did until being taken over by VA and good leadership. Once the folks were give direction and decent strats you succeeded.

FYI here is my final Post on SOH boards that was removed before anyone Saw it. Since we want to dredge up the past I will post it here and I won't be posting on the subject again. It is water under the bridge and the fact Ebonknight decided to RUIN SOH in place of letting the original Guild Leader have the Guild back as promised is on his Shoulders not mine. I do thank you for the compliment of saying I and I alone could destroy a guild.

Hmmm let's see I wasn't at the second MM hit, but I was at the first. Everyone griping and whining on a bugged script is just ludicrous. Officers’ acting like lack of listening caused a bugged script to fail is insane. Whether Ebonknight was at that raid or not if it is bugged it is bugged. I for one don't need Ebonknight on to succeed at killing a MOB, and I don't feel SOH as a whole does either.



Secondly how can everyone point at the heal team as the blame for a raid wipe? If they didn't show up on raids to attempt to heal the Tanks no raid would get very far. (Gasp) yes I mean lay off the healers. I wasn't there, but want to know how many of the tanks had the hot key I am now MT or I have Aggro HEAL ME?? So isn't it just as easy to claim the clerics didn't know whom to target, because the Tank didn't let them know? Not pointing fingers just making a point. When a raid succeeds everyone there contributed in one way or the other and when one fails the same holds true. I for one would take out our healing core as my healers on any MOB over any other guilds healing core and feel confident in the fact of knowing I would survive or they would die trying to make it so.



People had posted awhile back about the repercussions of hitting RZ every night he is up and SOH raids, but it fell on deaf ears. People explained you must have some successful raids along with learning the script, but the answer was this is the only target we have left to beat to be Elemental and we will hit him when he is up. A week later with people burned out, frustrated on no successful hits, and everyone being edgy and what I said could happen has started.



Implosion - Everyone blaming everyone else for his or her failures.



The only officer that handles all issues, since rest put AFK up when in game is Kuuldase, and now he is considering stepping down, because he is in a losing battle when it comes to being fair and working things out vs. just belittling people and kicking them out if someone stands up for their rights.



When an Officer (Kitska) says in Guild Chat and I quote this means yes they were indeed said.

"We are no longer going to keep carrying everyone to the EPlanes."

"If you don't want to support the guild and raid then go trade skill."

“ This is Ebonknights guild and we will do what he wants to do”

These among other catty and quite frankly childish, stupid, and sophomoric remarks are not the way to re-energize a guild of people you have (led) to their slaughter a week straight while trying to learn a new script. Then after 2 pages of this stuff to have the guild leader post if it indeed was said?? WTF there are 2 pages of remarks to this, but oh forgot pocket chanter never would say that.

Kitska you have never carried me or any other member of SOH anywhere. You need to step back and understand you wouldn't have the flags you do if it wasn't for 71+ other people in the raid you were on. So perhaps they have been carrying you and they no longer want to. Once again when it is a success it is 72+ people being the success not one. Not Ebonknight, not a cleric, not an enchanter, but a group of people during a raid with a like mindset and desire to succeed. Ahh and the reverse if it fails it isn't Ebonknights fault, one cleric, one other class, but a group of people's failure.

Why does someone have to be on a raid to be supportive of SOH? When I joined I was told we aren't a mandatory raiding guild. Whether it is mandatory or not if you get tells for not coming, things said in guild chat about people who are off doing other things, and to get in you have to have X amount of flags seems like a raiding guild to me.



When people began saying they would rather raid with SOH than AOR and an officer (ICRIVER) begins taking up for AOR instead of simply saying thank you for your support shows again leadership is growing weak. When ICRIVER calls a target to be OTM and says sorry it took so long to pick a target, but I didn’t want to piss anyone off shows his weakness as a leader. When he comes to the boards and posts on a hot topic such as members concerns and says it is a waste of time for him then he shows no leadership skills. The waste of time was reading his ramblings on his post that addressed nothing and was an oh well whatever post.





When the officer core begins arguing in guild chat among themselves and the members there is an issue a major issue. When the officers and members had a huge blow-up in guild chat and tells while everyone’s temper is flaring and one person a member is kicked from the guild for this while they are off line???? So people can’t take up for themselves when an officer bashes them or guild mates anymore. If they do the Leader who wasn’t there kicks them out without understanding the officers and members were wrong that night. Then to kick someone out of the guild, because of the actions of their family members while they are in tells with Ebonknight is BS. Coming to the boards and saying you didn’t have to go, they could have posted, you wish them luck like it was their decision challenges the intelligence of the Guild.

Farewell Stormwalker Family.

I am sure if things continue as they are that my Bro and Sis will be kicked out as well, because you know they can't think or act for themselves and should be held accountable for my actions..WTF ever

I have seen this before from experience as I have been on EQ on different servers, toons, classes, etc. for over 4 years. I have seen the strongest of guilds die overnight and the weak ones prosper into a real force. The strong ones who make it learn to recognize you must have success, you must build positive energy, and you must have a leadership team in place that can make the trip through the valley, hills, twist, and turns a fun and rewarding one.

Someone said a few nights ago we are acting like the Lakers and they hit nail on the head. We had a lot of success and now that we are having some losses instead of bettering ourselves, checking ourselves, and practicing we are pointing fingers, blaming others for our losses, and bickering among the players (members) and the coaching staff (officers). Now is a time for you guys to chose how will the dynasty go from here? Will you let it implode and split or will you work together understand you have areas to improve before pointing a finger and make this dynasty a legacy?



I had posted before if I ever felt I couldn't stand 100% behind Ebonknight as leader I would post and move on. Well here is that post.

I think SOH has great members and some great officers (the best ones are stepping down or have left) To follow a guild and wear it's tag I feel you must support the complete officer core and I can no longer do that. Kitska's actions as an officer went over the line in my opinion. I can no longer respect him/her as an officer, leader, or player. If I can't support Ebonknights decision of making Kitska and officer then I can't be 100% committed to Ebonknight. If I hate AOR and the skill set or lack there of it and an officer ICRIVER is going to argue with people who have this like mindset and feels it is a waste of time to address members issues then I can't support ICRiver or Ebonknights decision to make IC an officer.



Mainly though if Ebonknight really thinks that this guilds success or failures are honestly dependent on him being logged in then I know I can't support that. I have had way too many success pre SOH, during SOH, and will continue having them without Ebonknight being on game. If his new leadership style is to kick someone out of the guild while they are off line without talking to them, and then kick the rest of the family while they are trying to rectify the situation not a leader I can trust anymore.



I wish SOH the best of luck and if you stop this whining, bitching, fighting, complaining, and blaming you will make E Planes soon. If you don't then you will take a great Guild and make it another, we almost made it guild.

When you as a guild decide what to do I will be happy to fight along any of you in POP, GOD, E planes, and Time.

I am sure this post will be removed, flamed, and pissed on by a lot of people. Not that it matters, as I won’t see it. I will be away from the moaning, bitching, and officer abuse. If nothing else take away this YOU as a GUILD can do anything YOU as a GUILD set your mind to. Ebonknight has the ability to lead YOU as a GUILD to where you need to go as long as it goes back to the WE as a guild and not ME attitude in his leadership style. As long as attitude the guild will do what one person wants Ebonknight then you have a dictatorship. Actions mean more than words. This means you can say you aren't doing these things, but when in game you are just makes the post meaningless. When you can feel comfortable enough post your thoughts without repercussions while off line again No longer allowing officers to run rampant in a negative way, and thinking because you say I addressed it so it will go away and not up for discussion will began making people respect you again. You have to make that decision yourself as a leadership team on what you will do. This attitude is what we call in the real world a power trip, ego trip, and big head syndrome. Their needs to be input by the 200+ members of the guild on some things without them being flamed by the officer core. Once again not all the officers do this just a select few. Do these officers do a lot to help the guild? ICRIVER does as far as running Zerg hits on scripts with AOR raids, Leading Zerg hits


Take that for what you will as I said it is in the past and water under the bridge. Now the rest of the story take from it what you will. Flame yell scream do whatever I posted what happened from the otherside.

The person removed while off line had stated her opinion of the situation and was attacked by Kitska aso she logged.
She was removed from the guild. When her husband logged in he was talking to Ebon and had planned on staying in SOH, but Ebon deguilded him as well for his wifes actions on her toon.

Had it been she opened an application to another guild etc. etc. It would have been understandable she be kicked when the application was discovered. Even at that you wouldn't kick out the whole family because of one persons actions. This however was not the case it was simply everyone being on edge and the Officers and Members were arguing back and forth and Kitska decided to make an example.

Bow wow wow, yippie yo yippie yay.

Holy crap that's a long post I will have to read it when I get to work. It would appear there's certainly allot I didn't know given what I gleamed from that book. I was only in SoH for about 6 months until I started playing EQ2 allot more :\

As for who Deviant is, I don't know either considering all the whinning and bitching and love PMs I get from him I can only assume it's Mamadu though I don't know why he insists on hiding behind some stupid name.

EDIT: eesh well I can honestly say I never got see that post. I remember when you guys left, well I remember when Kuuldase left I hadn't really been there long enough to know anyone else but I remember him as being a great player and person. But never knew why other than what we were told...you all wanted to raid old world and not PoP. We were never lead to believe there was more to the story, that a group of friends left and that's all. Of course that's my perspective, but I was still fairly new at that point. Granted there's always two sides to every story, and if I never saw your post I'm sure others didn't and they also probably thought the same thing.

I certainly remember Kitska and Novalee as being two total bitches so no doubt what you say here is true, even though I don't konw of the incident you mention. I do recall Kitska not really playing much after you guys left though. In fact somewhere along RZ attempt #15 everyone stopped logging in as much. You're right, the first few attempts at RZ we got damn close but with each attempt it just got worse and worse. However, I still view Ebon as a good guild leader and I still think RL kicked his ass and caused him to make some bad choices. He was absent more than he was present and I agree some of his officers were less than capable. All those failed RZ attempts just burned me out altogether on EQ :cool:

It doesn't really matter now I suppose, since SoH doesn't exist. But I still think it was a good guild and could have been better had some things been different.

Nah, not Mamadu here, im just here to try to rile stuff up =/
I know Mamadu though, it hasnt been on eq in awhile, i miss his poor arse =(

Golly I guess it's circumstance that you and Mamadu have the same I.S.P. and sound so much alike. /boggle

Don't get me wrong, Ebon HAD a good vision when he took over SoH..Yes, the guild was given to him.. whether there was ever an agreement for him giving it back when the original GL came back from his RL issues, I don't know. Here's a few more points..from someone in SoH from before Ebon got GL status.
1- Officers were not manditory at raids ... ( Until Ebon wanted PoP progression)
2- Targets ... is it coincidence that Xanamech became a priority target when Ebon said he wanted the Piledriver ( I believe is the item) .. and by the way.. who looted the first one regardless of the " point system " ?? 3 guesses ...
3- Free speech -- All well and godd until you disagreed .. How many peeps were deguilded for disagreeing ??
4- Officer Core ... Amazing that ALL but 1 of the original officer core left because of Ebon's policies.. ( Hanadur stayed and is AWESOME by the way)
All this was before Snoop and Co were ever in the guild... SoH started it's downslide before Snoop ever showed up ... How do I know these things... Yes, you guessed it.. another toon of mine was an officer in SoH ( probably even recruited more people to SoH than Ebon even)...
5- 2 faced .. When I left SoH, I explained to Ebon why and was told.. "If you ever change your mind, your welcome back in SoH, even as an officer". Then he told another officer who was a good friend " I would never let them back as an officer" ..
Though Velvettouch is retired. and the Posse is no more....her memory lives on ... =P
and though I know that Ebon had some RL issues that really impacted him. . he really didn't handle situations in game very well at all.
Snoop.. remember when SoH wiped in FEAR and what could of been an easy CR turned into a marathon because when DOA offered to go drag all the corpses for them and rezz .. Ebon said no way.. I will have nothng to do with DoA ....LOL ...some leadership..make your guild suffer because of your personal feeling ....

Yep I remember that and the other Times we offered to help them and he refused.

I remember a Certain Awesome Chanter who needed help on A CR in Fear and he couldn't get help with it. We offered and he said nah I will go to the Raid Naked. He ended up getting help, since the Chanter needed Mana for Mezz. LOL that was classic.


OH well that too will be forgotten as will Ebonknight and unfortuntly
Sect of Honor as time goes on and it does.

How the hell do you fail to RZtW 15 times in a row with 72 people?

We had RZtW to 67% without a bard and without slow with 28 people on our second attempt. Maybe it was good that you split up.

RZtW isn't so much about strength, power, numbers, as much as it is about "getting it right." The encounter was tuned a lot as well. If you weren't on your toes, or didn't get the memo about how agro/leashing/whatever might have been changed at a dozen points along the encounter, you could just as easily die to an early point in the script.

But, I suppose this IS nag :)

triple the people = triple the dps. which means that without slow, without a bard, with triple the dps we had, we'd have won on the second try, golly.

How the hell do you fail to RZtW 15 times in a row with 72 people?

We had RZtW to 67% without a bard and without slow with 28 people on our second attempt. Maybe it was good that you split up.

Ok well it wasn't 15 in a row, some of those were AoR attempts and I don't think we had 72 people every time. We would wipe for the stupidest reasons..adds, someone over aggroing...but alas that's over. Some people probably attempted him more than that too. I like the more intimate and less time consuming raids of EQ2, I just don't think I could ever do 4+hr marathons again. Well maybe I could with enough caffiene!

FoAD , we did uber. Ahh good days...