http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/4128951.stm

- Quite literally the most catastrophic waste of human life for years.
Jesus or no, I'll say my prayers for all of Southern Asia and the Pacific.
13, 000+ dead in Sri Lanka alone. Terrible.

There was a video that a British reporter on vacation took of one of the waves coming into Thailand, I think. Incredible. This was definitely a terrible event.

And in addition to the 13,000+ they are also now speculating as many as 10,000 more bodies will be added to the count as waters recede.

Due to the conditions of those areas, it is probably a good bet that several thousand more will succumb to injuries and disease before proper aid can be fully available.

This is truly the major catastrophe of our recent history.:(

Still waiting to hear from my grandfather that was backpacking across thailand when this hit. Also, have yet to hear from an old friend of mine (some of you might know him as Slejk/Fandariella) who's in thailand at this time.

Wow...I hadn't even remembered him in a long time.

If you ever get in touch with him kivorn, tell fand a hi from Darus, he was a good friend to me back in the day, and hope hes ok as well.

The thing that worries me is that the tourist locations got hit bad. A large portion of the casualties were tourists enjoying the beaches along the coast. Phi Phi island is pretty much in pieces, and that's arguably the most popular locations for swedes down there overall.

Just read about this. Pretty tragic, indeed. There was apparently little or no warning in some places.

:(

Well, the news keeps getting worse.

This morning on the news they are quoting the leader of Indonesia as saying that there were 25,000 dead on one island alone, which was closest to the epicenter of the original quake.

Add on to the tremendous loss of life the fact that a majority of the structures on some of these islands were damaged and/or destroyed, and it becomes apparent the tragedy is going to continue to be felt for a long time as survivors are left in many cases without adequate shelter.

Bleh, up to 44,000 now it looks like. Thats horrible. I couldn't imagine how bad it would be to be there.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/12/28/powell.aid/index.html

Horrible situation indeed but when the UN opens up is big ass crack and spews out what its good at..big ball of crap, it just pisses me off. Wonder how much aid was sent to Florida and the southern states from the good old UN..not even close to the devastation in Asia at the moment but still billions and billions of dollars in damage and lost of many many homes.

Ibudin

I thought Egelund's comments were off base, too, until I remembered that costs for Bush's inaugural festivities are estimated to run $30-40 million (not including security). Even so, as casualty rates increase and the depth of the calamity becomes known, the US will continue to contribute relief. Hopefully, this disaster will prompt nations circling the Ring of Fire to put in place a warning system such as we have in the Pacific.

Guess I'm too tired to construct an even halfassed constructive post, so I'll just be unconstructive instead:

* The US contributions to foreign aid (per capita) aren't as great as you might think.

* You can use that aid to rebuild Florida. Not to diminish the relevance of the constantly occuring catastrophies hitting your southern senior citizen's retirement home, but if you're gonna thump your chest, cover your own. This is not a "hah, you had it coming!", it's simply... if you want to be Big Brother, don't complain about how you're expect to toughen up. I realize that the individuals of the US does not mirror its government, but that's how it works.

Jesus Ibudin.

Just shut the fuck up. You freaking conservatives are the biggest bunch of wanna be victims I have ever seen in my life. In a thread where people are talking about 50,000 people being killed all you can spew forth is some lame anti UN clap trap based on misinformation and misquotes.
The reality of the UN is that it is the single greatest instrument for health and humanity crisis allievation the world has ever seen. It has contributed in some collosal feats such as mass immunization and containment of diseases. It alone has the ability to move without concern of borders.
Is it a terribly effective political body?
Duh... No it isnt. We live in a political world that is unipolar in regards to political power. Thusly, the UN instinctivly will be a counter active force to try to bring some balance of power to the international stage. Like it dont like it, it serves as a voice where nations and people can have their voices heard, voices that otherwise would be inaudible.
No matter what we think or we know or what the reality is, people from other countries arent going to just march in line with the wishes of the US government. There is ALWAYS going to opposition and calls from political independence. Its called human nature. Get used to it, stop crying about it and be a big boy and start accepting the political reality of the world you live.

Or dont, and stay on the WAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHbulence with the conservative talk show hosts who daily bemoan their victimization from some trumped up evil force out to destroy all that is good, holy and American (according to some, the 3 are all synonomous)

Oh L2 has missed the boards. He couldnt wait to toss that out there..shut the fuck up. Ha you have got to be kidding me.

UN is a steaming pile of shit. Id like to see some of that money made from the good old oil for food scandel donated.

Until then take what you get and like it for its better than nothing.


Ibudin

The catastrophe still appears to be growing worse. More and more victims are being discovered in hard to reach areas and now they are estimating 60,000 victims or more.

Insults from UN officials aside, initial donations will be for emergency supplies for the short term. Long term assistance will be much more (likely in the billions of dollars) and will cover infrastructure, industry, etc.

It's way too early to slam wealthier nations for not donating enough. Wait and see what is offered versus what is needed once the facts are known.

As far as the general trend of western countries donating less and less of their GNP to the needy, that is a direct consequence of donor fatigue. Decades of *massive* aid utterly pissed away by mismanagement, corruption and stubborness have taken their toll on the generosity of many. We need to be smarter on how we provide aid and more importantly who administers that aid. Just throwing food/money/drugs at a problem creates new problems in the form of corruption, crime and political disruption.

Actually, you will see the US toss very lil cash the UN's way to distribute.

It's a corrupt innane self serving orginization.

However, I challenge any other country to match our personal contributions to the Redcross and the like.

I pray for those lives lost, and those that will suffer at the disease/famine...

Fandros Finglaflin

Just to toss out some useless info, Jet Li (actor) was at a hotel in the Maldives, and was able to grab his four year old daughter and get to safety.

Petra Nemcova (SI and Victoria's Secret model) spent 8 hours clinging to a tree and is hospitalized with fractured hip, broken pelvis, and internal injuries.
Her companion was washed away and fate is unknown.

And if we are going to talk about getting some of the oil for food money from the UN for Aid, maybe we can also get Cheney to donate some of the money made by Halliburton while he was CEO through their business dealings with a member of the Axis of Evil :p It is not just the UN folks that can be corrupt.


Great to have the boards back:cool:

Actually, you will see the US toss very lil cash the UN's way to distribute.

It's a corrupt innane self serving orginization.

However, I challenge any other country to match our personal contributions to the Redcross and the like.

I pray for those lives lost, and those that will suffer at the disease/famine...

Fandros Finglaflin

Again, Fandros, your per capita isn't anything to brag about. Also, you pretty much summed up the view many have towards your own government. The UN isn't pretty, but then again neither is your government's financial ties.
Not to turn this into some sort of bash me, bash you, thread but look at it objectively.

Well, with the largest contributors appearing to be the US (at about £18 million) and the UK (about £15 million), then all the better if the UN wishes to contribute billions.

And with disease now creeping in, the figure for the dead rising by at least another half is very plausable, without some sort of massive aid effort.

And yet, when all is said and done, they'll move back in.

Nature says, "Move."
Man says, "Or what?"

Interesting... I read that private charitable donations from Americans (that would not be included in the %GNP figures) totalled 241 billion dollars last year, up from 234 billion dollars the year before. That is a buttload of money. Much (maybe most) of it goes to domestic causes, but I think it's ludicrous to ignore that and claim we are stingy.

OMG who gives a big fat terd who contributes the most $$$$, look at all those dead people and you guys can only banter about $$$....that's pretty sick =X imo.

If you are concerned, find a charity that is helping and contribute somehow. I know several in my area have already set up boxes and stuff where you can donate and there's allot of missonaries doing stuff. One charity is putting together $5 boxes that have personal hygene and water purifying tablets in it. If you don't feel compelled to help, then don't but the banter about which organization donates the most $$$ is beyond distasteful in my book!

On another note....
I have to agree with TPFlaw though, it's just like the people in FLA rebuilding after 3 hurricanes, they will all move right back there and dare Mother Nature to do it again.


yet another note.....

You know it's funny how this first got started on the news and now it carries over to here. The media is undoubtedly the most manipulative aspect of modern lives. Instead of telling people how they can help they just find dirt and toss it in all directions.....this is why I don't watch, read, or listen to mainstream media it's sickening!

Where else are the survivors going to live? Of course they will rebuild there. If you make your living from the sea, you don't live in the mountains and there is no place completely safe on the planet.

One thing they *will* need to build is a warning system. It won't prevent damage, but it sure could cut down the toll in lives should another one happen. I'll tell you something else, we had better get one operating in the Atlantic too.

friend of mine had his girlfriend working in a french hotel that got totally wiped out. She isn't on the list of current survivor and its getting pretty safe to assume she died. Looking at what my friend is currently going through I think your "who give the most $$$" is sad and just seems to show how hearthless some of you are.

Two things....

I stopped watching the news about three years ago. I get most of my news from the CNN and MSN websites, as well as a couple from around the world... BBC, etc. I despise the media for the very thing that Fildien was talking about. Instead of being positive and being part of the solution, they seem to gravitate toward mudslinging and stirring up trouble. No thanks...


From what I have been reading, there is very little or no early warning system in place for the Atlantic ocean because of the lesser risk of this type of problem. However, there is a volcanic island off the coast of Africa that will (at some point in time) erupt and cause most of the island to slide off into the ocean.

When this happens, it is predicted to send multiple tsunami waves that will impact the east coast of the United States, South America and most of the islands in the Carribean with a wall of water that some estimate to be in the hundreds of feet tall. If this actually happens, the death toll would be in the tens of millions.

Because of the speed with which those waves move, (up to 500mph / 1000kph), there would be about 10-12 hours notice. I don't care how good your early warning system is... you just can't evacuate that many people in so short a time period.

When it happens, it will cause this tragedy to pale in comparison.

Just some thoughts....

Why do u guys have to argue with eachother over such a terrible event? If u feel the urge to say something idiotic save it for something thats not such a tragedy...

A good friend of mine and her sisters family were on a flight to one of the affected areas, luckily the flight turned and went back just in time...

On the news just now the numbers up to 67,000 + officially, but they are estimating as many as 120,000 deaths...

It's easier to argue about the peripheral stuff than to dwell on the dead. Human nature. When something this overwhelming happens, people cope in different ways. I am personally more concerned with preventing more death from disease than dwelling on those who have already died. Survivors can be helped, the dead can't. Money ties directly into that, hence the discussion about aid money and where it comes from.



As far as an Atlantic system goes, any warning is better than none when it saves even a fraction of the lives. The Indian Ocean was considered "low risk" too. Even an hour's warning would save many tens of thousands of lives around the Atlantic if something were to happen.

World news stated that the systems in place that the US has cost roughly 4 million dollars.

I dont really see anyone arguing on this topic about who spends what and how much..problem I had was with the UN/Media and thier ungreatfulness. It was uncalled for and at the wrong time.

Should the US give as much as they possibly can.?.absolutely
Should the UN and everyone else be greatful that they are recieving care/money when its needed even if its not enough?..absolutely.

Side note:
I can remember after 911 all the funds set up and put in place for people to donate. My employer was matching dollar for dollar what was donated and it accumulated to a large sum of money. Anyone remember all the problems with what actually happened to that money and the fact it really never got in the hands of those that needed it? I do and it was really disappointing.

Ibudin

I think your "who give the most $$$" is sad and just seems to show how hearthless some of you are.
Blame the bloke at the UN, Kinu. I think it pretty clear from the responses in this post that people consider this calamity with the utmost gravity, sympathy and sorrow.

/agree Thormir

In no way was I trying to downplay the tragedy but rather show my own disgust at how the spin of...."my daddy gives more money than your daddy" came into being during such a terrible time.

My heart goes out to everyone affected by this disaster :(

There are many forms of giving, and in situations like this cash is the most useful, as it can be directly wired and spent in the country affected, whereas giving "stuff" necessitates transporting costs and logistics.

Giving also takes the form of Thailand's offer of an air base for the US to use for it's cargo planes, varied naval craft in the area capable of providing drinking water/purification, etc.

I am hoping sufficient operable heavy equipment is available for prompt mass burials before the risk of disease becomes insurmountable. Clean drinking water and sanitation are two of the primary needs right now to avoid the death toll doubling.

No matter how many times CNN shows different video of the events unfolding, it is still difficult to comprehend the destructive force that could affect a dozen different nations.

What is so staggering about this one is so wide an area is affected. There have been far worse natural disasters in the last 100 years from a loss of life perspective, but nothing hitting so many different countries.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28nominal%29

I just saw on Fox News that France has pledged a whopping 135k. My dad makes more than that in half a year. Where is the outcry there?

The UN really needs to shut the fuck up. They're up to their neck in scandal, Annan has hardly a leg to stand on, and they're taking pot shots at the largest contributor of financial aid worldwide while completely overlooking nations like France.

I think your "who give the most $$$" is sad and just seems to show how hearthless some of you are.
What's going to help those people more? Feeling sorry for them, or actually backing it up with supplies and cash? It's not like they'd understand French prayer anyways. =P

What really hit this home for me was a scene on television where there was a wall just plastered with "Missing" signs. I can't even imagine the helplessness one must feel when the only hope they may have of seeing a loved one again is by taping a piece of paper to a wall filled with thousands of similar pleas for help. It's truly heartbreaking.

aww, france also sent planes with food/medecine etc etc as well as a full campaign hospital ( no idea whats the english name) and a few hundreds medics. europe as a whole unlocked 30 millions of euros.



Anyway first and last post on this subject, there are a lot of countries helping as much as they can which is what matter. Bill gate could give one of his billion ( hey he would still have 45 !) if he wanted to! Would own any help any country can bring.


edit: Friend's girlfriend is dead.

Well. I'm happy.
Grandparents are alright, so's my pal.

Good news, Kiv.

I'm glad to hear your relations are safe, sad to hear of your friend's loss.

It's hard to imagine being caught in such a tragedy so far from home with so little support.

Anyway first and last post on this subject
yay! too bad you posted on page 3

and another just for you kinu!!


http://news.bostonherald.com/national/view.bg?articleid=61061

I think the "subject" was Ainwen's false post. But who cares...

Sorry for your friend Kinu, and glad for your family Kiv.
It's a tragedy for mankind, but at least all mankind is helping the living ones now.

You dumbass.

My false post being the fact that I said Fox News reported France as donating 135k which is exactly what it did? I suppose it never crossed your mind that perhaps it was entirely true, and then *gasp*, THEY RAISED IT?! You know, kinda like the United States did too?!

I swear you damn euros will do anything to start a fight.

Major respect to Gates.
That guy's fricking awesome.

"and another just for you kinu!!


http://news.bostonherald.com/nation...articleid=61061 (http://news.bostonherald.com/national/view.bg?articleid=61061)"

Your point stupid fuck? I said if he gave a billion it would be more than what any country can bring. I m glad he gave a few millions, he is a great guy I was just making a point.

And anterak got it right, first and last post about ainwein stuff not on the thread in general. Stupid fuck x2

You dumbass.
Oh my. (

My false post being the fact that I said Fox News reported France as donating 135k which is exactly what it did? I suppose it never crossed your mind that perhaps it was entirely true, and then *gasp*, THEY RAISED IT?! You know, kinda like the United States did too?!
Aaaah now I see the light, in the morning, Fox News got the 135k donation, but, really bad luck you could say, by the evening France decided to raise it to 20 millions!! Like US did!! Tricky and sneaky govs we have. ;)

I swear you damn euros will do anything to start a fight.
Not my fault if my country wanted to trick Fox News. (

time for another revolution?


point was kinuvan, you asked why he didn't and he did, so whos the stupid fuck?

Ibudin basically has it correct imo. If the US doesn't freakin' jump up and make everything okay in every nook and cranny in the world we are heartless bastards. I wonder how much Saudi Arabia or Iran pledged?

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/31/us.aid/index.html

Omg, it's not 35 million you liars. STOP WITH THE FALSE POSTING ALREADY...

Last I knew a billion is 1000 millions and he gave 3? which is hmm let me try to explain in simple term so you brain connect, only 997 less millions? ( 1000 - 3 ! ). I never said he gave nothing I said and I m going to repeat myself that if he had given one billion ( 1000 millions) it would be more than any help any country could bring. Conclusion well, you still are a stupid fuck x3 :(

Anyone else wonder why the Donald is never heard from in these times of catastrophe?

:confused:

donald is a busy guy, he could be donating through a business to try and ditch the publicity??? not sure


and kinu, you are a retard if you think any billionaire should donate a billion dollars, i thought you were joking about the billion dollars and was wondering why he wasn't donating period, apparently i was wrong and should of thought of you as the retard you are and took you serious word for word

I swear you damn euros will do anything to start a fight.

Hey!!

http://www.theallineed.com/news/0412/303884.htm

Saudi arabia donated 10 million several days ago. could be more now but they have donated.

Was a suprise to see places like Qatar donate millions, a nice suprise. I think the disaster is really hitting home, world wide. Especially good to see help from such places that are in no danger of any major natural disasters. But like most people say, money right now is secondary to first-hand, and efficient, help. Disease needs to be protected from, bodies disposed of, the missing found, etc. The big bucks will really be needed in the major reconstructuring, which will inevitably take years.

"The United Nations says $2bn has now been raised in aid for the victims, including up to $500m in emergency assistance pledged by Japan"

- Wow, go Japan!

And, the cynic in me is wondering how many script-writers are pounding away at their keyboards trying to come up with the most sellable made for TV movie.

It really does a heart good to see the outpouring of assistance and global concern; the bottom-feeders will surely be finding ways to turn a profit from this tragedy, though.:(

I read a lot of webcomics and maybe I'm an asshole, alright I am an asshole, but it pisses me off to see how they've completely skipped mentioning the asian catastrophe in any shape or form.
The day after 9/11 they'd all made some sort of elaborate artwork.

A few deca-thousand kills later in asia they've yet to update their newsposts.

Yeah, that's the tragedy.

So start your own web comic and do it?

Meh. The point isn't that they're webcomics.
It's that I'm for once on my moral high horses and am appalled at the fact that not everyone is mourning the way my family and friends who've lost loved ones are.

The view's nice up here. Maybe I should get up here more often.

2 nuns died in a church fire on Christmas Day.

I don't see any threads here started by you about that. I guess they don't matter.

Hardly comparable.

Iv'e always liked this woman.


//http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/Movies/01/03/tsunami.bullock.ap/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2005/SHOWBIZ/Movies/01/03/tsunami.bullock.ap/index.html)

I knew she was more than an incredible hot body!
I just never had any proof.