Ok, i am now versed on all the loopholes and stuff....fire away.

Data plan + texting plans = how much now? 500.00???

Why no tethering? So lame.

There is tethering, except you'll have to jailbreak it to use with AT&T.

Buy your iPhone in Hong Kong at http://store.apple.com/hk to purchase it unlocked. It'll be the same price as AT&T's no-contract. Just need a Hong Kong shipping address.

no change to the data or text plan......

tethering has more to do with a billing issue than anything, and will be resolved. To be honest we have very few customers that tether.

They said it would be "soon" last year.

Now, they're the only iPhone carrier in the world not offering tethering or MMS (http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-10260012-37.html). Of course, it would stand to reason that not many customers would be using it when you have to jailbreak to do so.

Tethering doesn't really seem like that big of a loss. MMS is just a weird thing missing though.

MMS will come soon, basically AT&T has to removed a certain MMS block off EVERY iphone previously sold to get this done for the most part and apparently that is a challenge due to quantity.

Looks good, but I think I'm good with the 3G1 and firmware 3.0 for another year until the next model.

Looks good, but I think I'm good with the 3G1 and firmware 3.0 for another year until the next model.

Same, I'm looking forward to the update next week and then I'll wait until my upgrade time rolls around. I can't foresee spending $100, $200? more just to buy the new model for a better camera.

Unless there is a compelling reason to get it over the previous model?

processor is faster, the camera has video and video editing, it has a actual built in compass, app will be able to take advantage of more functions of the phone.

yeah I can wait :)
ty grey for the low-down!

processor is faster, the camera has video and video editing, it has a actual built in compass, app will be able to take advantage of more functions of the phone.

"Well, we're lost - but at least we know which way the north pole is"

Omfg make them stop coming!!!

Did they ever get the iPhone handling email as well as BlackBerry, or does it still have to poll for emails from the device and require you to send through an SMTP server?

No phone will ever handle email as well as Blackberry because they do all the work server side, while all our other phones including the iphone do the work on the phone.

ActiveSync is supported. If you have Microsoft Exchange or Zimbra, you can send emails you the ActiveSync protocol which does not run on SMTP. Push mail is supported with ActiveSync, as with other Windows Mobile phones.

Most of my email comes through Google Apps for Domains.

Blackberry Push is only supported with a mail server that runs its Blackberry server connector. It also routes all Blackberry emails through its central clearinghouse in Canada.

ActiveSync is a better protocol (in my opinion) because the Exchange/Zimbra/Kerio mail server will push the mail as well as process it directly, instead of using a Blackberry intermediary.

In theory, yeah. In practice, the BlackBerry servers are way on top of things. My Google Apps emails hit my phone almost instantly (as in, consistently less than 10 seconds after showing up in the box).

Google Apps works great with the BlackBerry too, because even after you POP messages with a desktop client (moving them to the archive), it'll detect the BB user agent and still serve those messages to a BlackBerry from the archive. That way you never sync issues where one device gets to the item first.

Gonna be pretty hard to beat that.

I've yet to have a problem with ActiveSync. I guess I'm a little wary when I have to trust the central clearinghouse of Blackberry servers. I've been using my iPhone in China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, and the US, and hardly have I seen the phone fail to deliver except to a lack of cell signal.

If you have a Google account, you can use Google's ActiveSync service (http://www.google.com/mobile/apple/sync.html) to push contact and calendar changes. I am not sure if it supports push mail or not, judging from the lack of information of the page.

Google Sync is just a GCal thing. I use it currently on desktop and BB.

Seems like there's no way around the fact that moving to an iPhone will be a downgrade for what I actually use the phone for. All the goofy apps are nice and everything, but I really just want fast, robust email support; which RIM is dedicated to providing.

What about the Curve 8900 vs the Bold? I had originally assumed the Bold was the way to go. I like the keys on it. They feel nice and smooth, but still well defined. The 8900 looks nice too though. Small is good. Is it as fast at the Bold? My older Curve is getting crushed CPU-wise by some of these apps.

You haven't cited an instance where the ActiveSync protocol is weaker than the Blackberry push method. In most cases, the kind of stability you are requiring will usually keep you well satisfied with ActiveSync. Google's mail service went down for a couple of hours earlier this month (?), and it's more likely that you will encounter problems from the server end than anything. In fact, since Blackberry mail requires an extra hop from the server end to the Blackberry clearinghouse to the Blackberry itself, you actually have an additional point of potential failure. Intellectual property suits almost shutdown the Blackberry mail service. ActiveSync would be managed directly by the Exchange or Zimbra server.

Although, to each his own. I have never had an issue with ActiveSync email, and I've also used a Blackberry prior to owning an iPhone, and I would say both handle equally well. Again, it seems more like a religious battle, not too different from the console wars (PS3 vs Xbox 360).

I have the Bold. the new Curve is nice, has a better camera, processor wise, even my Bold takes a pounding on some of these apps.

Both are decent choices, i just like the bold's feel in my hand better.

You haven't cited an instance where the ActiveSync protocol is weaker than the Blackberry push method. In most cases, the kind of stability you are requiring will usually keep you well satisfied with ActiveSync. Google's mail service went down for a couple of hours earlier this month (?), and it's more likely that you will encounter problems from the server end than anything. In fact, since Blackberry mail requires an extra hop from the server end to the Blackberry clearinghouse to the Blackberry itself, you actually have an additional point of potential failure. Intellectual property suits almost shutdown the Blackberry mail service. ActiveSync would be managed directly by the Exchange or Zimbra server.

Although, to each his own. I have never had an issue with ActiveSync email, and I've also used a Blackberry prior to owning an iPhone, and I would say both handle equally well. Again, it seems more like a religious battle, not too different from the console wars (PS3 vs Xbox 360).

Maybe you're misunderstanding what I'm saying.

ActiveSync could be the greatest thing since SMTP, but I still don't have the option of using it. I'm definitely not going to completely change my email hosting just to accommodate a phone.

The BlackBerry offers me push email and the iPhone doesn't. That's what I care about, not the protocol or what the iPhone offers someone else who isn't me.

Does the 3GS feature better battery life?

I'm happy with the 3G's battery for all that the phone can do, but I wouldn't want any less despite the slightly improved features on the 3GS.

they claim to have improved battery life.

Has anyone tried activating the tethering without jailbreaking your phone yet? I've heard a few friends have done it and claim it works great. Just curious if anyone else has yet.

DO NOT TETHER EVEN IF IT DOES WORK!!!!!! Tethering like on all our phones has an extra associated cost.

There is a good chance you could be billed usage charges for tethering.

im going to look into it to verify, but i would NOT RECOMMEND you doing it, if it works yay it will probably be released officially (with corresponding plan) with the MMS update in a few *weeks???*

Okay I'm going to work for Excell ( company closely associated to Microsoft) and they have great plan with ATT. I was looking at picking up the eternity and was wondering why an Iphone would be a better deal?

Clearly this thread is of secondary importance behind the Iran thread...please to focus!!!

1) Keep updated on Iran
2) Eternity vs Iphone!

It is cooler and those that you wish to um have “relations with” will notice you and you will have relations more because of it!


I have used plenty of windows phones most locked up half the time, and were cumbersome to navigate. I did however like the fact i could jam sd cards in them and move data easily from pc to camera to phone etc.

Iphone has nice apps, and is getting better with each update. I do not know about the 3gs, but the 3g I have has been great all I can recommend is the non glare screen cover apple store sales, and a good rubber case. I use the incipio that has the hard plastic part that covers the back and edges.


Oh also it is apple so Rybit will be your friend and Sansex will take it as a stab at him!
SC

Well....

it works, it works very well I'm typing this from someone's phone from my work computer.


what are the extra charges?! and why would there be? iphone owners pay for data already!

On the BlackBerry, it's $60 for 5gb.

No input on the eternity???

I don't think any of the iPhone clones have turned out to be anywhere near as good as the real thing. If you're going the screenboard route, might as well get the best.

Well....

it works, it works very well I'm typing this from someone's phone from my work computer.


what are the extra charges?! and why would there be? iphone owners pay for data already!


its $30 for a pda to have data, its $60 for a pda to have data and tether....yes it doesnt make sense, yes its to make extra money.

they will charge you per kilobyte on a regular PDA, so please please dont tether yet, i would hate for you to find out what .01 per kilobyte translates into when you use it for a day.

Eternity is a decent phone. It was one of our first midrange touch screen phones. Its pretty decent.

Peoples first instinct is to try and use the touch screen like an iphone. doing so will make you pretty disappointed, it is NOT an iphone.

It is a solid midrange touch screen with a VERY nice camera, TV and Navigator options, along with an acelleramator or however the hell you spell it.

I personally LOVE Samsung theyhave been very reliable products i hae sold over the years.

So, while I of course know exactly what 'tether' refers to, I think someone should explain it for...the lurkers.

Eternity is a decent phone. It was one of our first midrange touch screen phones. Its pretty decent.

Peoples first instinct is to try and use the touch screen like an iphone. doing so will make you pretty disappointed, it is NOT an iphone.

It is a solid midrange touch screen with a VERY nice camera, TV and Navigator options, along with an acelleramator or however the hell you spell it.

I personally LOVE Samsung theyhave been very reliable products i hae sold over the years.

I personally like Samsung too. Currently using the Epix but have used a Blackjack and BJ2.

tethering is using your phone as a modem.

its $30 for a pda to have data, its $60 for a pda to have data and tether....yes it doesnt make sense, yes its to make extra money.

they will charge you per kilobyte on a regular PDA, so please please dont tether yet, i would hate for you to find out what .01 per kilobyte translates into when you use it for a day.

hrmm had a few people so far say they haven't seen any charges, I wonder. :D

at this point i have warned multiple times, so do what you want. if you get a $500+ phone bill i hope the websites you went to were awesome!

it's not like i work there or anything.

Tethering (connecting your phone to a PC or laptop to use your cell data plan to surf the net / download), like Text Messaging, is something that could easily be covered under an unlimited data plan but is not so that the phone companies can charge a fee for them.

With tethering, there is one other reason for charging for it: to limit the number of users that use it. I mean, even with the iPhone, your data transfer is going to be low in comparison to what you can do on your computer... web surfing (rich content), downloads, gaming, porn, etc. With the current networks, if everyone who owned an iPhone was able to freely tether, the 3G data networks would be saturated.

Some day (read: next 5-10 years) we will have the infrastructure in place to support true competitive high speed WiFi (20+MB/s over "cell" networks) and at that point everyone can expect to have free tethering as part of their data plan. For now, only those that have to have it and are willing to pay for it can do it.


And Grey... was the rumor that people may get charged for tethering something that you heard AT&T as an employee? Cause... I could think of a couple reasons they would want such a rumor to spread...

And Grey... was the rumor that people may get charged for tethering something that you heard AT&T as an employee? Cause... I could think of a couple reasons they would want such a rumor to spread...

The charges are something i have experienced in a customer service manner on other PDA's when people have tried and tethered.

Some day (read: next 5-10 years)...

That is basically what 4G will be complete VoIP voice calling and unlimited data.

Just use a Cisco VPN hookup to circumvent tethering checks (which I presume they will be looking for browser agents that are not MobileSafari, unauthorised protocols, and the like). The iPhone and AT&T allow for you to connect using VPN. With VPN traffic, they won't be able to do deep-packet inspection. Not that I tether, but I use the VPN feature on my iPhone to access company internal databases (such as the ERP and G/L, A/P, etc).

Virtual private networks are encrypted, and theoretically, you could just be watching YouTube all day through a VPN. Since all traffic is encrypted, and is legal and permitted by the iPhone and AT&T, there would be no way to figure out what you're actually doing under a VPN since an IPSec client is installed on the iPhone.

^^ ding ding ding
that is exactly how we were doing it ;)

Ok i talked to one of the data managers today.

Tethering is a violation of the Apple End User Agreement along with the AT&T Agreement.

With that being said, from the way i have seen things done, there is ways to circumvent detection, but you can be damn sure both Apple and AT&T are trying to find new ways to prevent going around things. If you get caught you can be charged the data usage and/or have your service terminated AND charged the Termination Fee of $175 for breeching the agreement.

Talking to an apple guy they said there is potentially ways they can brick your phone remotely for any violations of the terms and conditions.

So proceed at your own risk.

Typical response one would expect.

They are either going to have to catch up or suffer, the iphone wave will only go so long. Their 3.0 update was supposed to address things like MMS and tethering and they lied to us; it's not going over well. Since you work for the man though I'm not going to post any more about how my friend was doing or what he was doing. If however, anyone is interested it's all over google.

Greystone,

Not that I understand AT&T is very against tethering, but AT&T damaging hardware you own is criminal (you have a PURCHASE receipt from the Apple Store or provider). Are you saying that if I buy a car and I drive it to school instead of work, you can permanently damage my car? That is not legal, and if AT&T insists they can damage phones for tethering, there would be at minimum civil suits if not criminal suits for damage of personal property.

In addition, if you own a legally-unlocked iPhone 3G (these are sold in Hong Kong, Singapore, Italy), damage of your iPhone is highly illegal and considered anticompetitive. Legally unlocked iPhones such as mines support tethering without any software modification since you are able to access the "Network" menu.

Sure, it may be a violation of the terms of agreement. But it is your hardware, and AT&T bricking your phone is sure to be a criminal violation of personal property rights. So if you watch your TV on unauthorised channels, you're saying I can brick your TV? I hope AT&T managers are ready for the handcuffs, because willfully destroying personal property to limit choice supersedes any civil violation to terms and conditions. Not to mention, the new FCC people are very against limited choice of carriers, which does not work in AT&T's favour either.

It's not feasible, either. There is no way to "permanently" brick an iPhone, short of interrupting a restore. The iPhone modifications are just software, and if there are problems, you will be able to just format and restore it.

It doesn't seem unreasonable for them to get the extra fee for tethering. Circumventing that is stealing from them.

yeah not sure how they can brick your phone given that I know people who have jailbroken their phones and restored them to the factory settings and everything was right as rain. it would certainly be interesting to see them do this and what the backlash/reactions would be. like I said the wave can only go so far, people are already pissed.

The point of bricking isn't to permanently damage the phone any more than spanking a child is meant to permanently keep it from being able to sit.

Ah. I was familiar with the practice, but not the term. I mean, the lurkers were. Might have even tried it once or twice way back when.

It doesn't seem unreasonable for them to get the extra fee for tethering. Circumventing that is stealing from them.

I agree that AT&T should charge a fee and people will pay for it if it is reasonable. My only problem is the same with the music industry. Disconnection is a fine solution, but in all honesty, I believe AT&T will just charge extra fees or penalties since it is always nicer to make money than cut off money.

The point of bricking isn't to permanently damage the phone any more than spanking a child is meant to permanently keep it from being able to sit.

Bricking, in the most traditional sense, used to mean permanent damage. If it is because the user is poking around and the phone bricks, that is the user's own fault. Now if the provider or carrier is willfully bricking a device, that is still illegal and almost likely criminal.

Two wrongs don't make a right, and Apple trying to prevent unauthorised unlocking two years ago with the original iPhone have already investigated the legal consequences of permanently disabling/willfully disabling a device due to unlocking, which is likely to be criminal. If it is the result of the user poking around where he shouldn't and wiping parts of the EPROM, then that is the user's own cause. Now if they are trying to abate an undesirable function on the phone willfully and permanently disable the device, that would be criminal damage, such as wiping an unauthorised phone's EPROM, thereby permanently disabling the phone.

Apples and oranges. You're stealing AT&T's service when you tether that way, not just expanding the capabilities of your device. Maybe if you were using it to tether through a WiFi connection, I could see the comparison (say if you had a laptop with USB but no WiFi modem).

Screw around with the rate caps on your cable/DSL modem and see how quick you get bricked (and kicked off the service permanently). Same with a cable or satellite box.

This form of consequence isn't new at all. I would be surprised if any legal harm could possibly befall AT&T for that.

Apples and oranges. You're stealing AT&T's service when you tether that way, not just expanding the capabilities of your device. Maybe if you were using it to tether through a WiFi connection, I could see the comparison (say if you had a laptop with USB but no WiFi modem).

Screw around with the rate caps on your cable/DSL modem and see how quick you get bricked (and kicked off the service permanently). Same with a cable or satellite box.

This form of consequence isn't new at all. I would be surprised if any legal harm could possibly befall AT&T for that.

So viewing a webpage on a computer screen instead of a small phone screen is tantamount to an entirely different service, although you are still subject to the same bandwidth speed? You have, after all, paid for the same data plan, and there are no specified caps or limits. You aren't doing anything except sharing the connection to yourself. By your reasoning, routers that share one cable modem connection to multiple computers is the same as stealing Internet connection, since you should pay a computer fee for every computer connected to the cable modem? Can you imagine if you had to pay a phone jack charge for every phone connected even though you are just using one telephone line?

So if you can get around the fact that sharing an Internet connection is illegal (such as those with routers to multiple computers with cable modems) even though you are paying for that connection, then let's talk about the consequences...

Disconnection is fine. Breaking a device is not. You don't see the cable companies breaking your computer, right? Users who tether without paying for it is fine to disconnect, but to break a device is not legal.

Also, please cite an instance when a cable modem has bricked. The most I've known them to do is to disconnect. When have they actually permanently destroyed a cable modem?

The issue I have with your argument is that I don't see how it is STEALING, when you are actually PAYING $30 a month to use it. That's not exactly cheap for a subpar Internet connection too. I also have problem with your cable/satellite box analogy, since it sounds like you are trying to get services for free, when you are already offered the full version of the Internet on your iPhone which you pay $30 a month. There were apps on the iPhone App Store that enabled you to proxy to your phone before Apple put in a kernel-level NAT sharing feature. It's no different from taking a cable modem and sharing the connection through a router. The iPhone's data connection is the baseband, which is a modem, and the tethering is the NAT router.

The irony is that AT&T sells other phones (such as Blackberries) that have tethering and an unlimited data connection, yet AT&T did not make a big deal out of it. If they are going to enforce this tethering rule, they need to drop the double standard. Disable or charge extra for tethering on other phones. What about phones that are unlocked that allow you to tether without any modification? What about new phones that enable you to do cooler stuff with the connection that AT&T might not like?

All of this makes me fiercely unhappy with the mobile phone network competition in the US. No wonder the US has a terrible reputation for cell networks since we are all used to being screwed over. Try doing that in Hong Kong--see how long you will stay in business.

So viewing a webpage on a computer screen instead of a small phone screen is tantamount to an entirely different service, although you are still subject to the same bandwidth speed? You have, after all, paid for the same data plan, and there are no specified caps or limits. You aren't doing anything except sharing the connection to yourself. By your reasoning, routers that share one cable modem connection to multiple computers is the same as stealing Internet connection, since you should pay a computer fee for every computer connected to the cable modem? Can you imagine if you had to pay a phone jack charge for every phone connected even though you are just using one telephone line?

Using circumstantial arguments on the periphery and/or strawman legal claims really doesn't change that it's obviously an attempt to weasel around reasonable rules.

You know full well that you're going to use way more bandwidth when tethered. So does everyone else. So does AT&T. Hence, it's a higher service plan. If you don't like the potential consequences, just don't cheat on the tethering! If you must have tethering right this second, use a BlackBerry like I do!

Disconnection is fine. Breaking a device is not. You don't see the cable companies breaking your computer, right? Users who tether without paying for it is fine to disconnect, but to break a device is not legal.

I didn't buy my computer from my DSL provider and sign an agreement with them regarding my computer hardware though. Again, as with all the rest of this, apples and oranges.

Also, please cite an instance when a cable modem has bricked. The most I've known them to do is to disconnect. When have they actually permanently destroyed a cable modem?

I got one of my Cablevision modems bricked around 1999-2000, by fiddling with the DOCSIS stuff to raise my caps. While I was learning how to do it, I read plenty of stories to the same effect. It was great if you kept under the radar, but they'd brick you quick otherwise.

Same with illegal cable boxes for TV, going way farther back.

The issue at have I have with your argument is that I don't see how it is STEALING, when you are actually PAYING $30 a month to use it. That's not exactly cheap for a subpar Internet connection too.

You're paying for an iPhone plan, not an iPhone and everything you can figure out how to dangle off it plan. Even though an iPhone is data-intensive for a phone, it's extremely light compared to most of what you'd do tethered.

Bottom line is, you know you're out in left field when you have even me defending AT&T. I think they're generally profiteering douchebags, through and through, but this one makes perfect sense.

or you could use an unlocked iPhone from Hong Kong with AT&T, not subject to the conditions. I didn't buy an iPhone data plan; I bought the regular data plan as well as the phone service. It puts it on the same footing with the Blackberry, since I didn't sign an AT&T iPhone T&C. Full response to your answers after i get out of a meeting.

No, it's not a straw man's argument. You should know that. A data connection is a data connection. Tethering is NAT routing.

I encourage everyone to buy your iPhone from Hong Kong, purchase a regular data plan, and do not agree to iPhone T&C's.

You still didn't cite an instance where they actually bricked the cable modem. If you cite an instance where do this, I'll happily concede there is precedence for them to that. What I'm talking about is permanent, irreversible damage. Can you prove this? I would like to see written accounts about permanent, irreversible damage to a cable modem. Not personal and anecdotal accounts to keep it unbiased.

I'll be back in about 35 min to write full answers to your arguments. I'm enjoying this debate, but really, I feel you're wrong on this one.

You still haven't answered how these business practises make perfect sense.

or you could use an unlocked iPhone from Hong Kong with AT&T, not subject to the conditions. I didn't buy an iPhone data plan; I bought the regular data plan as well as the phone service. It puts it on the same footing with the Blackberry, since I didn't sign an AT&T iPhone T&C. Full response to your answers after i get out of a meeting.

Are you paying for tethering, as you would with a BlackBerry (it's extra on any plan)?

You still didn't cite an instance where they actually bricked the cable modem. If you cite an instance where do this, I'll happily concede there is precedence for them to that. What I'm talking about is permanent, irreversible damage. Can you prove this? I would like to see written accounts about permanent, irreversible damage to a cable modem. Not personal and anecdotal accounts to keep it unbiased.

Huh? It happened to the modem that was sitting 3 feet from me. If you don't believe my written account, why would you believe one of the thousands of others (http://www.google.com/search?q=cable+modem+bricked) any more?

I might still have the modem in my closet. We could send it for forensic examination in your upcoming class action suit against AT&T!

You still haven't answered how these business practises make perfect sense.

Tethering users use orders of magnitude more data. A plan is priced based on the average use expected for a device. It makes perfect sense to me. What part of this doesn't make sense to you?

If AT&T were your business, would you allow people to circumvent the pricing that you had calculated as what is necessary to be profitable?

I encourage everyone to buy your iPhone from Hong Kong, purchase a regular data plan, and do not agree to iPhone T&C's.

The data plan gets kicked automatically now if you use an iphone without and iphone plan. You will get tons of phone calls and letters saying so then after about 6 months i think they just remove the data plan from your service.

Also the AT&T T&C's actually state using the iphone on the network is giving consent to the T&C's. So i would not encourage people to buy an unlocked Hong Kong iphone.

Sorry about the confusion but bricking in Apples world means they freeze it and you have to take it to a corperate store to get unbricked.

Man, the email on this thing is like fingernails on a chalkboard after using a BlackBerry for a year.

Son and I are purchasing a set of the new Iphones once we get to Washington and get the employee discount with ATT.

What's that going to set me back? Yes I could likely find out myself but atm I'm attempting to man a 8 man boat, 16 oars, alone and manage to get this all done ;P

Even with discounts they are still $200 or so plus $100 a month with another 50 or so per additional phone, varying on what package you get. These are luxury items.

Yeah, and then they bleed you dry $0.99 at a time for apps.

okay so mangeable...

He'll have to work to purchase his own apps and downloads.

Thanks folks.

There are tons of free apps though that are plenty useful... just take a look.

Indeed there are very few apps that I've actually purchased.

Also my bill is roughly $147 after all taxes and junk for two iphones, both with unlimited text that's with my 26% discount via my company.

Yeah, some of the free ones are nice, definitely. Some of the must-haves are not free (or even $0.99) though. Especially if you want to buy apps to bring it to parity with a BlackBerry's functionality.

aye, some of the freebies don't have all the same functionality.... especially the RDP clients/VNC and term emulators.

Well, must have mybrute ;P

After that I'll have to grow into it.

Basically:

8gig 3G $100
16 gig 3G S $200
32 gig 3G S $300

700 min shared, $70
1400 min shared, $90
2100 min shared, $110
Your employee discount only covers the above rate plans, or bigger, but not whats listed below.

Iphone package $30 per phone , get your unlimited data usage, email, gps

Texting:
$5 is 200 texts, and thats 5 per line.
or $30 and the whole account gets unlimited.

First bill will have $36 and $26 dollar activation fees. We can't waive these for apple, and VERY FEW employee discount codes waive activation fees but some do.

Cases typically run $20-$50, with the Otterbox, the $50 dollar option, once its rereleasd, i HIGHLY recommend.

also, car charge you will find usefull or another usb cable, that you can charge your phone from your PC at worm

Initial costs don't bother me, although I find activation costs insulting for any product ("Hi, we're so happy you chose us and our product, we're going to charge you just to set it up."). Those monthlies are painful though - if I went cheap, that's $70 just for the plan, and another $30 for data, so I'm assuming a minimum $100 a month for an iPhone?

I've debated purchasing one - some of the apps are very useful in my field, and the iPhone works with some of the new theatrical lighting equipment out there. But the price tag for the monthlies would kill me.

The $70 is for a family plan. It's not quite so bad for a single phone.

1 phone cheapest is 450minutes, $90 will get you iphone with unlimited texting.

although I find activation costs insulting for any product

Yeah, but we are just copying power, water, and cable companies :P

For what it's worth, I've never paid activation/upgrade fees when I buy online. Just when I buy in stores.

Yeah, but we are just copying power, water, and cable companies :PDefinitely not singling out phones - I was actually thinking of the bastards at Cox.

Another new feature of the 3GS that I heard about on the CNET video review that I haven't really heard about anywhere else is a new voice command/dialing feature... looked pretty nifty.

However with ATT/Apple not offering much of a break on pricing for mid-contract customers, there is basically no chance that I would dish out the dough for the current upgrade.

I just heard an interesting rumor from one of our telco guys, the AT&T rep told him that they are going to start doing audits to see if an iphone user is accessing corporate assets (intranets, vpn, email, etc) and if so they are going to charge them the business data plan rate.

I just may decide to try a different smart phone if this happens, even if it meant paying to get out of my contract. This is akin to AT&T saying fuck net neutrality!

That seems pretty much impossible to realistically police.

My thoughts too but the telco guy said the rep was very convincing.

I can see them nailing a few well-known avenues, but it's damn near impossible to tell a high-usage client who is doing non-"enterprise" stuff from an "enterprise" one unless they're clearly connected to iphone-vpn.bigcorp.com.

Heh. I think I need to change the Cisco VPN IPSec address to a IP-based one instead of a DNS based one and use an address that doesn't have a reverse DNS record... I was also under the impression that IPSec works under UDP, which to my knowledge is more difficult to inspect?

Of course, I use the VPN all the time in China and get about 50% of domestic US access speed and don't have to worry about pages being filtered out. Mainland China hasn't/isn't able to ban VPN access, partly because it is important to businesses and businesses aren't the ones they're worried about it (actually they're more accurately colluding with businesses at times), when it's the masses of people they're worried about. People always wonder why the Chinese communists won't just flip over and announce that they're really a corporatist/capitalist government--they're just afraid of doing it too quickly like post-Gorbachev Russia.

Seems odd - wouldn't non business, i.e. surfing, use more bandwidth and cost more?

They're trying to clamp down on people using their iphones for business without buying a business plan, not on the actual usage impact. Blackberry's do the same with their enterprise setup, that's just more monolithic and you can't really fake it out.

So...why?

It's because business users have more money. Let's say you wanted to bring 10Mbps cable modem to your home; it's probably 40 USD/month. Now try doing the same thing to your office: it will cost you 120 USD for the same thing. It's not about usage; it's just that business users seem to have more money. That's the only reason, and business users probably _won't_ run torrents, while personal users will--and as we know, torrents are extremely bandwidth hungry.

I just may decide to try a different smart phone if this happens, even if it meant paying to get out of my contract. This is akin to AT&T saying fuck net neutrality!

Its got nothing to do with Net Neutrality. It specifically says the $30 package is for X and the $45 is for Y. Just because you want to do Y but pay X prices isnt AT&T taking a stance whatsoever....

That being said, i wouldnt worry about this too much. Tethering yes, enterprise usage no.

There are a number of reports of some iPhone 3GS models severely overheating, supposedly to the point of even discoloring the plastic on some white-colored models.

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/06/overheating-iphones/

http://www.maclife.com/article/%5Bprimary-term%5D/iphone_3gs_overheats

http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/07/18/att-is-a-big-steaming-heap-of-failure/

Man, I'm glad I don't live in the Bay area sounds like they have some issues. However, after reading this article I called a few people and asked if they'd left me any voicemails recently and they said yes. I haven't gotten squat in weeks for vmail on my phone. I didn't think much of it b/c I don't typically listen to my vmail to begin with but I still found it interesting. I wonder if the Apple AT&T contract will renew next year?

If you aren't familiar with TechCrunch's M.O., they just roll around spewing whatever bile they can to stir up drama and get pageviews. AT&T does suck more than it doesn't, but assume anything on TechCrunch is blown 10x out of proportion.

Verizon will not be carrying Iphones. Verizon announced that they will be blocking all 3rd party applicaiton stores, Blackbery AppWrold, upcoming Nokia store, and windows version. They will no deviate for ANY phone for 3rd party applicatons, all will go through verizon channels if they want to be on a verizon phone. Apple will not let this fly. There is multiple articles on this topic.

Sanchek you find often time to talk shit aobut AT&T but after what you claim is years of having it why dont you leave? Verizon, Sprint, T-Mobile, MetroPCS perhaps?

Probably because they are parto of illegal oligarchy of phone services we can't avoid!

Sanchek you find often time to talk shit aobut AT&T but after what you claim is years of having it why dont you leave? Verizon, Sprint, T-Mobile, MetroPCS perhaps?

Way to perfectly embody the general perception of AT&T and its employees!

Verizon will not be carrying Iphones. Verizon announced that they will be blocking all 3rd party applicaiton stores, Blackbery AppWrold, upcoming Nokia store, and windows version. They will no deviate for ANY phone for 3rd party applicatons, all will go through verizon channels if they want to be on a verizon phone. Apple will not let this fly. There is multiple articles on this topic.

Sanchek you find often time to talk shit aobut AT&T but after what you claim is years of having it why dont you leave? Verizon, Sprint, T-Mobile, MetroPCS perhaps?

And I'm inclined to think that if Apple were to say hey Verizon we're no longer going to be exclusive with AT&T you want a piece of the pie that Verizon would ditch all it's puffy chest talk and take it in a heartbeat. Everyone knows iPhones have been a great boost for AT&T any carrier with half a brain knows that and won't turn down a chance at having them. I would LOVE to see some competition :)

I can buy any software I want from 3rd parties on my Treo on Verizon. *shrug* But then again, its a phone so why the hell would I need other software other than calling and checking e-mail is beyond me :)

The iphone is more like a handheld laptop with a phone added than a phone with other stuff added.

Exactly what Malse said.

Except that your laptop battery lasts longer!

My iphone gets 6-7 hours of full usage, which is about 3 more than the average laptop I've seen.

I know that batteries on the 3GS I've ran across was horrid. Granted, I don't have one personally, but the attorneys that have them here say the new battery life leaves much to be desired.

I can't turn on constant push with emails for example or the battery runs out after literally an hour.

Yeah, there is definitely something wrong with the 3GS, but I think it has more to do with software than the actual battery. Push email is apparently a killer, but general usage is nominally better than the 3G for just using it as a phone/ipod.

If an Iphone can't play Eve or LOTRO it doesn't matter what kind of computing applications it can use! Don't you guys have trouble typing on that dinky keyboard, or do you have tiny lady/midgit fingers?

Some people use computers for work, and while it takes getting used to, any sober person with enough manual dexterity to pick their own clothes can get used to it fairly quickly, although there is invariably a 3-6 day "chiclet keyboard hate" phase.

E.g. Malse wrote that endless sentence on his iPhone.

I have excellent battery life on my iphone, no complaints there.

Using v3.0?

Yes. My OS version is 3.0 (7A341) I go all day without having to recharge it. I'm constantly surfing the web, checking email, and doing facebook, IM and other apps while at work. I plug it in to be charged over night while I sleep and wake up to a fresh phone ready for my day. That's not to say if I hung on the phone several hours I wouldn't drain my battery but then my bberry for work is the same way. I don't have to charge it for days unless I get a ton of calls and pages but then I don't use it to surf the web or do other apps it's solely just a phone.

Dave, you switched to an iPhone? :P

Just be careful, it's a gateway drug to OS X/BSD.

He's lasciviously rubbing the upcoming Mono port so he can stay in white-picket fence .NET land, with his pot roast, pipe, and Any Griffith reruns.

The reason Objective-C doesn't have garbage collection is because it would take out the whole language.