http://www.ahmadinejad.ir/

Can Bush say the same for communicating with rest of the world?

I may not agree with everything the man does but I give him kudos for reaching out and trying to explain the reasons for his governance.


Cheers,

Wow! check this response of his to an American Mother of a soldier in Iraq who died.

In the Name of Almighty God, the All-knowing, the Most Lovingly Compassionate



Venerable mother

Greetings



First of all, I apologize for the delay of answering your question. This is due to my heavy schedules. So far, I have received many letters – with the same type of messages - such as yours.

If your son opposed to go to Iraq and impose pressure on the people of that region, and then was forcibly taken there, certainly Almighty God would help him. And those who have forced your beloved son to go to the war are responsible for his blood and the bloodshed that they have caused. They should answer Almighty God in the Day of Judgment.

In regard to statement you have made, since I did not want my reply lead to any problem for you, did not send it through e-mail, because if some agents are getting into private life of the American citizens and eligitimatley control them, may create problem for you. Instead, I decided to post the reply on the web log that those who may have the same views such as yours, get the answer.



Respectable lady

We respect all people of the world- including the American people. We think highly of all human’s life, dignity, reputation and also their properties. Our religion – Islam- does not allow us to disturb the peace and tranquility of human beings. Even those Iranian mothers who have lost their children due to American atrocities in Iran or those children, who their parents have been martyred, do not concur that the American people be immolated for the wrong-headedness and arrogance of their Statesmen. Even the Iranian girls and boys, who have lost all their family members in U.S. warship attack against Iranian passenger airplane in Persian Gulf, do not assent that Iran initiates any war. For eight years, we defended ourselves against all-out invasion of Saddam who was supported by the world powers. And any type of weaponry, intelligence and supplies that he needed was provided to him immediately. Our people were not even safe from Saddam’s chemical bombs. When the green light was given to Saddam by the big powers - including U.S. government - he tested the most lethal chemical weapons – produced in the west – on the innocent people of Iran.



What benefit do you think Saddam and his masters in United States of America and some other countries drew from the imposition of the eight year war on Iran? Nothing! Even a square foot of our land was not kept occupied by Saddam’s forces. They could achieve none of their illegitimate goals and wills. Our youths with the strength of their faith, defended their own land and astonished the world.



Dear sister

Of course, we too hate war – as you do. Certainly, we are not panic-stricken of a defensive war, but we believe there are many diplomatic and peaceful ways and approaches to intercept paranoidal bullying and expansion policies and practices of U.S., Zionist usurper regime – the occupier of Palestine – and Britain. I assure you that Iran would not initiate any war! Unfortunately today, the entire world is somehow afoul of some hostile powers and politicians that are non-edified, power greed and warmongers. Consequently, thousands of innocent human lives are being lost every day and many mothers mourn their beloved children. The greed of the aforementioned politicians for wealth and power is unbounded. The atmosphere of threat and intimidation has made the life unpleasant and miserable for every human being of different nations. Unfortunately, you are not the only one who is tormented and aggrieved from the egoistic politicians with their egotistic mentality. Everyday in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and almost everywhere in the world, many fathers and mothers mourn their children and have become grief-stricken. Their outcry would not go beyond the high wall of powers - that based on wealth and weapons.



Tormented mother

I hope the people of the world bring to book these egoistic and bellicose politicians – who have immolated everything for the interest of a few companies and certain groups. I am confident that you and American people would not trust the pre-fabricated lies and complicated, poisonous propagandas that are made and broadcasted by the inhumane, aggressive and capitalist networks. And you do search and try to find out about the truth. Perhaps as you know - so many times - the Zionist media and those that are related to power clans, have even distorted my own words, and have told the people of the world, bunch of untruth regarding my country as well. I know that the environment you live in – even though there are many large networks of media that are affiliated to certain groups - to discover the truth is very difficult, yet, to uncover and expose the truth, for the intelligent people of that region does not sound impossible.



I am sorry to say that the American people are kept in an absolute censorship concerning the outside world by their government.



I am certain if the American people know where and on what, their tax money are spent, even the strong supporters of the government would not stand it and rush to the street to show their opposition in regard to that issue. What you can do is - to break the aura of deception and fabrication which has been created by the media affiliated to the government - and try your best to uncover and reveal the truth.



Esteemed mother

I hope that the world we live in would never see the darkness of a war and the people of the world can bring their call for peace across to the warmongers who have appeared as statesmen and call themselves as the guardians of others. I hope by early withdrawal of U.S. occupied forces from Iraq, peace, tranquility and fraternity would come back to the region. I also hope that the people of Iraq be able to live in peace and harmony next to their families and continue their own lifestyle. And finally, I hope that the American youth live next to their families and serve their own country.



If you rely on Almighty God, you would succeed.

But he doesn't say they won't shoot and kill her son, if needed, just that God would be with him because he didn't want to go there....

"God will be with him" can mean sooo many things....
I will say he does place an interesting spin on things, and is a very eloquent writer.

did you guys read the comments on the right side of the page? You have intelligent people posting great comments, and then stupid Americans posting the most disgusting things possible.

And even amongst the Americans there are really nice comments. Worth taking a look to see what we sound like to the rest of the world.

I saw a choice comment in there from Great Britan, as well....
Also, it looks as if there is a vetting process to what is posted.
I'd be interested to see what the postings might say without the review process in place....

Yea, would be interesting. I was surprised some of them actually got through honestly.

Yea, would be interesting. I was surprised some of them actually got through honestly. And you get played again...

?

How many of Iran's political prisoners wish they had an unfiltered access to a blog?

A small sample of writers and journalists persecuted for saying something they shouldn't have:

http://hrw.org/english/docs/2007/02/06/iran15271_txt.htm

Since the election of President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, the situation for Iranian writers has worsened. Authorities systematically suppress freedom of expression and opinion by closing newspapers and imprisoning journalists and editors. The few independent dailies that remain heavily self-censored. Many writers and intellectuals have left the country, are in prison, or have ceased to criticize the government in their writings. Recently imposed rules of publication have further narrowed the field of acceptable speech.

This year’s recipients of the Hellman-Hammett grant from Iran are:

Ali Ashraf Darvishian, 65, one of Iran’s most prominent and prolific post-revolutionary writers, has published more than 20 books, including fiction, children’s stories and a 20-volume collection of Iranian folk tales. For the past four years, government censors have banned the publication of his works.

Shahram Rafizadeh, 34, investigative journalist and blogger, also writes poetry and literary criticism. During the reform era, Rafizadeh was well known for writing about the role of Iranian intelligence agents in the murder of several writers and intellectuals in 1998. He was detained in September 2004 and was held in solitary confinement for 86 days.

Roozbeh Mir Ebrahimi, 27, worked as an editor and reporter for a number of reformist dailies that have since been shut down by the government. He investigated several high profile human rights cases, including the murder of a Canadian-Iranian photojournalist in 2003. He was detained in September 2004 and held in solitary confinement for 60 days. He has written two books on contemporary Iranian political history that have not received government permission for publication.

Arash Sigarchi, 28, journalist and blogger, started his career in journalism at the age of 15. He was arrested in January 2005 after he reported on human rights violations on his blog. Originally sentenced to 14 years in prison, an appeals court reduced the sentence to three years. He was recently diagnosed with cancer and is receiving treatment outside of prison.

Ali Afshari, 33, political analyst and human rights advocate, was imprisoned in 2000 and held in solitary confinement for 328 days for his role in the student movement. He has written numerous articles and co-authored a book on political theory. When he left Iran in 2005, the Judiciary sentenced him to six years in prison.

Ensaf Ali Hedayat, 41, journalist, has reported extensively on human rights violations in the Iranian province of Azerbaijan. He was arrested in June 2003, spent 74 days in solitary confinement and 18 months in prison. He currently lives in exile and is writing his prison memoirs.

Hassan Zarezadeh Ardeshir, 29, journalist, has written extensively on the political environment and human rights issues in Iran. He has been arrested several times and spent nearly eight months in Evin prison in 2003. In 2005, he was forced into exile, but continues to report on human rights violations in Iran from abroad.

And yet you praise this mother fucker for this openess?

I won't bother, Not getting involved in another bullshit debate with you Akipt.

Akipt has a point.
Open-mindedness is in the eyes of the beholder....
All this talk of Americans not having access to the uncensored truth, why don't we hear from the uncensored Iranian?

They only speak out when they want to "spend some time by themselves"....

uh huh, right.

Go ahead and change the subject back to how great Hamas or Hezzbollah are so you can feel all righteous about your freedom fighters then.

How about the fact that America funds groups within Iran with the sole purpose of causing unrest and building a rebellion against the government.

Iran is so paranoid that they stop anyone from speaking out. It is wrong, it is horrible, but it is also the unfortunate truth that we have something to do with that.

Please don't dare tell me we are not involved in this, because it has been on the news many times, with many ex government officials explaining how we have been working and funding to find ways to initiate a regime change.

Why don't you also ask the Dixie chicks how they feel about Freedom of Speech?

I'm fairly certain of a few things.
1) That Ahmadinejad didn't write that, but it was ghost written by a member of a PR company. My girlfriend had had 3 Op Eds in the New York Times and 2 in the Washington Post, but most certainly they were never by her but rather Ambassador (name)
2) They put the disgusting comments of American's up there, possibly actually written by Americans and possibly also written by the staff of the blog.
3) they only put positive posts by Iran nationals up there, for the same reasons.
4) If Bush had a blog, it'd be the exact same - in reverse.

I'm fairly certain of a few things.
1) That Ahmadinejad didn't write that, but it was ghost written by a member of a PR company. My girlfriend had had 3 Op Eds in the New York Times and 2 in the Washington Post, but most certainly they were never by her but rather Ambassador (name)
2) They put the disgusting comments of American's up there, possibly actually written by Americans and possibly also written by the staff of the blog.
3) they only put positive posts by Iran nationals up there, for the same reasons.
4) If Bush had a blog, it'd be the exact same - in reverse.

All possible

Why don't you also ask the Dixie chicks how they feel about Freedom of Speech?I'm sure their 189 days in soiltary confinement being raped daily by the guards was appropriate.

I won't bother, Not getting involved in another bullshit debate with you Akipt.

Jedd,

You have to admit the regimes of the Ayatollahs have been just as harsh on human rights as were the Shahs regime.

These people are not saints nor do they care who they throw in prison or torture, at least admit the truth about them. You can get imprisoned for speaking out, just like people did under the Shah and pretty much everything that was deemed a crime against the state then is considered one now. Just throw in the woa be to those who do something so minor as draw a picture of allah and you have a thouroghly modern Iran!

Jedd,

You have to admit the regimes of the Ayatollahs have been just as harsh on human rights as were the Shahs regime.

These people are not saints nor do they care who they throw in prison or torture, at least admit the truth about them. You can get imprisoned for speaking out, just like people did under the Shah and pretty much everything that was deemed a crime against the state then is considered one now. Just throw in the woa be to those who do something so minor as draw a picture of allah and you have a thouroghly modern Iran!

Oh I agree that they are a tough bunch, and don't allow proper freedoms to their people, however I also aknowledge that we have a part to play in their fear of dissent.

Oh I agree that they are a tough bunch, and don't allow proper freedoms to their people, however I also aknowledge that we have a part to play in their fear of dissent.

They really are not that tough. They talk a good line and hide behind women and children. Whether it be the Iranians, Hezbollah or Hamas each one has repeatedly been a part of deliberately causing terror beyond their sphere of influence, and by terror I mean targeting Women and children. Bottomline is, We and the Israelis just do not deliberately target civilians.

The Israeli's have numerous videos of Hezbollah fighters launching rockets from apartment complexes, people yards and residential areas. Why do they do that? Because they know that Israel will either drop a bomb on the rocket launcher thereby causing civilian casualties or they know the more likely scenario of Israel not hitting them at all because they are in a civilian occupied area.

Why not try this: Instead of trying to justify the actions of a repressive Iranian government, work to reform it and fight for the civil rights of it's citizens. Would that not be more of a noble cause?

They really are not that tough. They talk a good line and hide behind women and children. Whether it be the Iranians, Hezbollah or Hamas each one has repeatedly been a part of deliberately causing terror beyond their sphere of influence, and by terror I mean targeting Women and children. Bottomline is, We and the Israelis just do not deliberately target civilians.

The Israeli's have numerous videos of Hezbollah fighters launching rockets from apartment complexes, people yards and residential areas. Why do they do that? Because they know that Israel will either drop a bomb on the rocket launcher thereby causing civilian casualties or they know the more likely scenario of Israel not hitting them at all because they are in a civilian occupied area.

Why not try this: Instead of trying to justify the actions of a repressive Iranian government, work to reform it and fight for the civil rights of it's citizens. Would that not be more of a noble cause?

Neither Hezbollah nor Iran deliberatly target Women and Children. It seems once again the bias in the media is leading some of you in the wrong direction.

Iran is tough on its people as far as freedom of speech, and womens rights mostly in cases of sex.

However, Iran does not indescrimenantly kill women and children, and i do not know where you get this information.

Hezbollah also does not directly target women or children. Hezbollah fires rockets into Israel because of the continued occupation of the Sheba farms. We have already debated this, and the Anti Iran/hezbollah arguments have been found clearly lacking.

Israel uses Palestinian children as human shields when entering buildings and fires on people putting out fires, or at children. They routinly stop children from crossing the borders cutting them off from their schools. To use Israel as a comparison is quite frankly idiotic.

Like i said, we have a big hand to play in the Iranian leaderships fear of dissent, though they are mostly to blame for creating a system that would allow them to fear dissent.

Interesting site along this line of discussion.

http://www.freedomhouse.org/template.cfm?page=363&year=2007&country=7197

Do you need visual aids?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bdbA2Ka3Bo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEuKnJ54DUI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV1scn536BU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7Sxi7W8OmA&feature=related

-Edit
On a side note - I always find it somewhat funny, yet very sad that when people research something on the internet, they only search for the negative of the country they are trying to demonize, yet they do not make sure their comparisons are clean of such acts.

I will admit Iran has a lot of problems, and I have seen every video on youtube or elsewhere that i could find about it. It just seems that no one else ever types in something Negative after America or Israel in google or youtube to see what others see us and our allies doing.

Interesting site along this line of discussion.

http://www.freedomhouse.org/template.cfm?page=363&year=2007&country=7197

Interesting map, showed Iran as not free obviously, but also showed the Israeli Occupied areas as not Free.

How about the fact that America funds groups within Iran with the sole purpose of causing unrest and building a rebellion against the government.

Iran is so paranoid that they stop anyone from speaking out. It is wrong, it is horrible, but it is also the unfortunate truth that we have something to do with that.

Please don't dare tell me we are not involved in this, because it has been on the news many times, with many ex government officials explaining how we have been working and funding to find ways to initiate a regime change.

Why don't you also ask the Dixie chicks how they feel about Freedom of Speech?

Sheer unmitigated stupidity from Jedd once again, /gasp.

Their freedom of speech wasn't taken away, folks got pissed off at the lead singer and quit buying their CD's.

Damn you are so off base sometimes.

How about a lil proof that we're funding groups inside Iran? Personally I think a black op strike on a collective few there could release the moderates to regain control but I'm wanting to hear your unsubstantiated proof.

Fandros
"Praying Jedd is summoned to the Motherland soon"

Sheer unmitigated stupidity from Jedd once again, /gasp.

Their freedom of speech wasn't taken away, folks got pissed off at the lead singer and quit buying their CD's.

Damn you are so off base sometimes.

How about a lil proof that we're funding groups inside Iran? Personally I think a black op strike on a collective few there could release the moderates to regain control but I'm wanting to hear your unsubstantiated proof.

Fandros
"Praying Jedd is summoned to the Motherland soon"

No Fandros you show you'r sheer stupidity... Let me tell you why.

Is this freedom of Speech?

Dixie Chicks film about censorship censored

The American tv-network NBC and the CW Television Network has refused to air ads for the new documentary ‘Shut Up & Sing’, about the top-selling American country band Dixie Chicks

According to Drudge Report, NBC has stated that NBC “cannot accept these spots as they are disparaging to President Bush”, and the CW Television Network stated that the network does “not have appropriate programming in which to schedule this spot.”

The ad features footage of lead singer Natalie Maines declaring during a London concert in March 2003 that the band was ashamed to come from the same state as Bush; Texas. Her statement caused a row in USA where many radio stations banned Dixie Chick’s music, with a subsequent drop in sales of their CDs.

The new film about the drama that followed is directed by Oscar-winning filmmaker Barbara Kopple and Cecilia Peck, daughter of the late Gregory Peck, and premiered on 27 October 2006 in New York and Los Angeles, USA. It will open in cinemas nationwide in USA on 10 November.


Strongly criticised

Ralph G. Neas, president of the nonpartisan People For the American Way, which advocates free speech, strongly criticised the reported NBC decision.

Famed litigator David Boies stated, “It is disappointing and troubling that NBC and The CW would refuse to accept an otherwise appropriate ad merely because it is critical of President Bush."

The movie’s distribution company Weinstein Co. stated that it regarded the rejection of its ads as evidence of political censorship by NBC and CW and said it was now exploring taking legal action.

In 2004, Michael Moore’s film “Fahrenheit 9/11” distributors faced the same barrier with NBC.

http://www.freemuse.org/sw15143.asp

Is it? Perhaps to you asshole, but not to me.

And if you do not already know that we are funding groups in Iran you need to turn on the tv and watch CNN, and even Fox News will tell you Fandros. It has been brought up multiple times by Ex government officials on television news that we are funding those in Iran to incite the rebellion neccesary for a Regime change.

Go watch some news Fandros then come talk to me when you know what the fuck you are talking about.

That is a great example of FREEDOM OF SPEECH. They said things that people didn't agree with it. The Dixie Chicks lost a ton of money because they exercised FREEDOM OF SPEECH...

That is a great example of FREEDOM OF SPEECH. They said things that people didn't agree with it. The Dixie Chicks lost a ton of money because they exercised FREEDOM OF SPEECH...

The argument is not in the loss of money... but the censorship that followed, they were not allowed to pay for advertisement on NBC or the CW, and were constantly bashed on network news (Fox News).

You call this free? Hell yea its better then being killed but don't sit with the illusions that we are all free all the time.

That is a great example of FREEDOM OF SPEECH. They said things that people didn't agree with it. The Dixie Chicks lost a ton of money because they exercised FREEDOM OF SPEECH...

A major difference here is that those in Iran who have been publicly decrying the moves of Ahmanutjob in his game of nuclear chess have found themselves being arrested, and persecuted. The former nuclear negotiator to Europe has just recently been released after being imprisoned for his overt opposition to Ahmanutjob's direction.

The Dixie Chicks (who I liked even more for having the courage to stand by each other after this fiasco) were never arrested. People who objected simply withheld their dollars from CD and concert ticket sales.

A major difference here is that those in Iran who have been publicly decrying the moves of Ahmanutjob in his game of nuclear chess have found themselves being arrested, and persecuted. The former nuclear negotiator to Europe has just recently been released after being imprisoned for his overt opposition to Ahmanutjob's direction.

The Dixie Chicks (who I liked even more for having the courage to stand by each other after this fiasco) were never arrested. People who objected simply withheld their dollars from CD and concert ticket sales.

I am not comparing Iran with America, indeed the punishment in Iran is much more harsh, however you have to admit that the response from the networks was a direct reaction and a major form of Political Censorship.

Iran is 20 times worse in its censorship as the punishment is VERY harsh, however i was simply commenting on what we have going on over here.

The truth is George Asshole Bush is trying to overthrow the Iranian Regime, and people just do not understand what that entails. The Iranian government has to not only worry about the average joe who doesn't agree with them, but some nut jobs that will do and say crazy shit to instigate a riot or rebellion.

Do they have a right to be paranoid? yes
Are they right in arresting people for their beliefs? no

The issue here is not what they do to their own people, it is what we are doing to them.

The argument is not in the loss of money... but the censorship that followed, they were not allowed to pay for advertisement on NBC or the CW, and were constantly bashed on network news (Fox News).

You call this free? Hell yea its better then being killed but don't sit with the illusions that we are all free all the time.

Censorship has always been a part of broadcast television.....just look to the Smothers Brothers. And yes, it is fucked up. But, imprisonment seems a tad harsher than losing air time on the televison.

Censorship has always been a part of broadcast television.....just look to the Smothers Brothers. And yes, it is fucked up. But, imprisonment seems a tad harsher than losing air time on the televison.

Aye, and Iran is a tad harsher then the US. No one is denying that.

The same can be said about Don Immus or any other person who has said something distasteful. If you own/run a TV station you are allowed to play what you like. Sensor ship is more about...ah Janet Jacksons breasts popping out, bleap of swear words ect.. Dixie Chicks pissed off the people who make the decision who the hell is going to get air time and who isn't. Its a tough industry to be in because you best be prepared for the repercussions of your mouth.

The same can be said about Don Immus or any other person who has said something distasteful. If you own/run a TV station you are allowed to play what you like. Sensor ship is more about...ah Janet Jacksons breasts popping out, bleap of swear words ect.. Dixie Chicks pissed off the people who make the decision who the hell is going to get air time and who isn't. Its a tough industry to be in because you best be prepared for the repercussions of your mouth.

over 50% of America is saying Fuck Bush, the networks are the minority :)

So much has changed since then.

Did the Bush administration (or anyone in the government for that matter) call up either of those stations and demand that they not play the Dixie Chix?

Of course not, so you're completely off base again. That's called capitalism. The fact you can't tell the difference is a fundamental reason why you're a fucking dumbass.

Did the Bush administration (or anyone in the government for that matter) call up either of those stations and demand that they not play the Dixie Chix?

Of course not, so you're completely off base again. That's called capitalism. The fact you can't tell the difference is a fundamental reason why you're a fucking dumbass.

What the hell are you even talking about? I recognize the difference very well thank you. It is still rediculous to have censorship because of ones beliefs, doesn't matter on what level.

Welcome to America where you are free, until you say something people don't like, and then they tell you you are still free, but they will censor you... but grats on being free.

Joe: Hey man welcome to America, how does it feel to be free to finally say whatever you want!

Mohammed: Wonderful, Now i will continue my career as a singer and advertise my new movie on NBC, oh how wonderful it is to be FREE, FUCK BUSH, oh how great it is

Joe: What the fuck are you doing Terrorist?!?!

Clear Channel: Fuck you Muhammed, go back to Iran you terrorist camel jockey!

Mohammed: Oops...

You call me a fucking dumbass? yet you have provided nothing in any of the topics worth even discussing.

Oh and here you go for the Iranian version to be fair

Mohammed: Fuck Ahamdenijad!

Iranian police: SIEZE HIM!

Ahmadenijad: Throw him in Prison

Muslim Mob: HOW DARE YOU THROW MOHAMMAED IN PRISON!!! OFF WITH HIS HEAD!

(I have no idea where i am going with those, i just had fun putting it together and rolled with it)

You laughable puddle of goo...

While I admire the Dixie Chicks for both their talent and moxie they did not suffer a loss of the Freedom of Speech.

In the words of great SNL monologue....Jane you ignorant slut...

Go back to Iran you miserable sot and talk to others as you talk to us. Let's see how long you defend that mislead nation.

Yes I understand a dislike for Bush and Co, they mismanaged the war and I'm not happy about how it WAS handled. It's being handled much better now and if Iran would stop helping to kill my brothers and sisters in the US Military I'd not have much to say against them atm.

Or if they hadn't nabbed and held my countrymen in the late 70's...

Or if they hadn't helped fund organizations that target women and children....( you denying it doesn't make it not so ya git)

I get my news from all sources, Fox happens to be one but it's not my biggest influence ;P

You're really confused here, Jedd.

A private business choosing to protect the interests of its owners and shareholders is not censorship. If Al Gore suddenly started pushing a pro-life stance, you'd better bet that the liberal media interests that have promoted him so heavily would similarly run for cover. Again, not censorship. Just doing business.

Now, if you show me an instance of the FBI showing up at a Dixie Chicks concert and shutting it down, we can talk.

You have enjoyed such broad freedoms here that you apparently cannot even conceive the concept of what true censorship is. It is that very lack of censorship that allows you to pontificate on your terrible attitudes toward the very freedom that you enjoy, yet still retain it.

You laughable puddle of goo...

While I admire the Dixie Chicks for both their talent and moxie they did not suffer a loss of the Freedom of Speech.

In the words of great SNL monologue....Jane you ignorant slut...

Go back to Iran you miserable sot and talk to others as you talk to us. Let's see how long you defend that mislead nation.

Yes I understand a dislike for Bush and Co, they mismanaged the war and I'm not happy about how it WAS handled. It's being handled much better now and if Iran would stop helping to kill my brothers and sisters in the US Military I'd not have much to say against them atm.

Or if they hadn't nabbed and held my countrymen in the late 70's...

Or if they hadn't helped fund organizations that target women and children....( you denying it doesn't make it not so ya git)

I get my news from all sources, Fox happens to be one but it's not my biggest influence ;P

Everything that just came out of your mouth is pure bullshit.. How hard is it for you to understand that I am as American as you, you fucking idiot.

I was born in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA... Telling me to go to Iran doesn't do shit but make you look even more like a Racist bastard.

I speak with Iranians in Iran DAILY, I post a forum that is moderated by Iranians in Iran... Wanna check it out? www.irandefence.net (http://www.irandefence.net.You) You wouldn't last 2 days on these forums, because Americans are the minority... People all around the world including Israeli's and Iranians post on it daily and debate these topics... Fandros you are a fucking idiot that knows nothing, you think you are justified in your beliefs but all you are is a dog on a leash with Bush holding the other end.

Fuck you

/grin

kiss kiss cupcake...

Embrace your Iranian roots you so seek to shove down my throat chum. Hell I'll pitch in to buy your ticket back!!!

/grin

kiss kiss cupcake...

Embrace your Iranian roots you so seek to shove down my throat chum. Hell I'll pitch in to buy your ticket back!!!

Thats what i thought... No balls to post on a forum where you aren't the majority....

Just like the USA always fighting battles against people who can't win, and never fighting those who would embarass us... Brave Fandros!

Listen bitch... You are a nobody in this world... I live in Los Angeles, fuck your women, enjoy my life shitting on people like you daily.

Talk shit all day long... the US is Afraid of Iran you fuckin idiot... You think the US has ever let any country shit on us more then Iran has without attacking them?

Fuck you... Iran is the light shining in the desert, the only fuckin country in the world that has the fuckin balls to stand up to us... You are nobody... Go watch some American Idol bitch.

Jedd's lil PM to me, told you he had a soft spot for me ;)

Cheer up boyo, you're almost there!!!!

I have to ask "fuck your women"

I have but one and she's surely not in LA...land of miscreants and fakers....or is that fakirs???;P

Ahhh I'm nobody eh?

I'm a USAF Vet child, who served in the first Storm in yee old shining Desert. Was bunked up in Khobar towers right before it went boom ;( Lost alot of good friends to that fucked up religous extremist fucknuts out there.

How do we start up a paypal account to buy him a ticket!!! Someone quick before he realizes the only balls he has are the anon internet kind!!!

I have to ask "fuck your women"

I have but one and she's surely not in LA...land of miscreants and fakers....or is that fakirs???;P

Ahhh I'm nobody eh?

I'm a USAF Vet child, who served in the first Storm in yee old shining Desert. Was bunked up in Khobar towers right before it went boom ;( Lost alot of good friends to that fucked up religous extremist fucknuts out there.

How do we start up a paypal account to buy him a ticket!!! Someone quick before he realizes the only balls he has are the anon internet kind!!!

Wow congrats on not ending up on the streets like 70% of your buddies. :(

I guess i can't be mad... Afterall you are programmed by the US of A. Maybe i should raise my hacking skills to get through to you.

Ending up on the streets like 70% of my buddies?\

Are you fucking insane as well as blantantly stupid?

The homeless rate isn't that high, but you'd know best reading the rags you tout so highly wouldn't you?

Good god this guy has fallen off this rocker. Your a disgrace even for the Iranians.

Ending up on the streets like 70% of my buddies?\

Are you fucking insane as well as blantantly stupid?

The homeless rate isn't that high, but you'd know best reading the rags you tout so highly wouldn't you?

Veterans do make up 1 in 4 homeless people in America... According to the news :( that is 11% of the general population... A lot of people wouldn't ya say? Pretty sad isnt it?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-11-07-homeless-veterans_N.htm

Good god this guy has fallen off this rocker. Your a disgrace even for the Iranians.

Fandros makes me mad beyond belief, his frequent use of insults and incompetent posts drive me over the edge.

I speak with Iranians in Iran DAILY, I post a forum that is moderated by Iranians in Iran... Wanna check it out? www.irandefence.net You wouldn't last 2 days on these forums...Wow. Just wow. So I went and looked around. First post in the "Anti-Israel" forum I find this gem:

"Israel is the only country on Earth where you get a one month community service for intentionally smashing the head of a child."

I mean seriously, get the hell off my board.

Wow. Just wow. So I went and looked around. First post in the "Anti-Israel" forum I find this gem:

"Israel is the only country on Earth where you get a one month community service for intentionally smashing the head of a child."

I mean seriously, get the hell off my board.

LOL there are some extreme people on there, but there are tons of Israeli's backing themselves up. You probably took sarcasm or a joke as something serious... It is a great forum. Check it out more.

Everyone calm down. No more baiting.

Jedd, your line of thought regarding censorship should be abandoned. It's a waste of precious bandwidth.

Sorry Thor, was a throwback to the days when we'd bait the latest tewl and relieve daily stress ;P

That being said his bullshit antics and antiAmerican rhetoric will not stand as long as I'm able ;P

Neither Hezbollah nor Iran deliberatly target Women and Children. It seems once again the bias in the media is leading some of you in the wrong direction.

Iran is tough on its people as far as freedom of speech, and womens rights mostly in cases of sex.

However, Iran does not indescrimenantly kill women and children, and i do not know where you get this information.

Hezbollah also does not directly target women or children. Hezbollah fires rockets into Israel because of the continued occupation of the Sheba farms. We have already debated this, and the Anti Iran/hezbollah arguments have been found clearly lacking.

Israel uses Palestinian children as human shields when entering buildings and fires on people putting out fires, or at children. They routinly stop children from crossing the borders cutting them off from their schools. To use Israel as a comparison is quite frankly idiotic.

Like i said, we have a big hand to play in the Iranian leaderships fear of dissent, though they are mostly to blame for creating a system that would allow them to fear dissent.

It's funny but I know people in the IDF who live in the US and not one of them would ever consider using a child as a shield. I will agree that children are routinely stopped from crossing into Israel and cut them off from schools, but this is a reaction to the FACT that children are routinely used as bombs as their families are promised that the child will live in heaven and that the family will get a few thousand dollars.

Now in response to my above paragraph I will say that this is probably done by the palestinian population because they have a feeling of total hopelessness in their present situation.

I would lay the blame on that right at the feet of the leaders of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah as their whole existence relies on a populace that feels hopeless. Kind of a Muslim Fear Factor. Keep them hopeless and keep your power.

I know of no instances where the government of Israel has advocated that Israeli children strap bombs to themselves and detonate in a restuarant. Do you? I do know of instances where the leaders of Hamas and Hezbollah advocate that the youngest children attack the IDF. Hey it makes for good PR, the IDF kills a kid and even though he was throwing grenades it still makes the IDF look bad.

Like i said, we have a big hand to play in the Iranian leaderships fear of dissent, though they are mostly to blame for creating a system that would allow them to fear dissent.

So with that reasoning we could blame the Soviet Unions repressive regimes on the US?

I lay the blame on the Iranians repressive regime on their leaders desire to forcefully stay in power.

Neither Hezbollah nor Iran deliberatly target Women and Children. It seems once again the bias in the media is leading some of you in the wrong direction.

Iran is tough on its people as far as freedom of speech, and womens rights mostly in cases of sex.

However, Iran does not indescrimenantly kill women and children, and i do not know where you get this information.

I might get my information from things like actually seeing with my own eyes a group of Hezbollah militia pull a bus full of children up near the Beirut airport and then stand with that bus behind them as they indiscriminately fired automatic weapons and RPG's at US Marines who DID NOT fire one shot in retaliation for fear of hitting a child, however there were a few times the back blast from an RPG did damage the bus and shatter windows.

It's funny but I know people in the IDF who live in the US and not one of them would ever consider using a child as a shield. I will agree that children are routinely stopped from crossing into Israel and cut them off from schools, but this is a reaction to the FACT that children are routinely used as bombs as their families are promised that the child will live in heaven and that the family will get a few thousand dollars.

Now in response to my above paragraph I will say that this is probably done by the palestinian population because they have a feeling of total hopelessness in their present situation.

I would lay the blame on that right at the feet of the leaders of groups like Hamas and Hezbollah as their whole existence relies on a populace that feels hopeless. Kind of a Muslim Fear Factor. Keep them hopeless and keep your power.

I know of no instances where the government of Israel has advocated that Israeli children strap bombs to themselves and detonate in a restuarant. Do you? I do know of instances where the leaders of Hamas and Hezbollah advocate that the youngest children attack the IDF. Hey it makes for good PR, the IDF kills a kid and even though he was throwing grenades it still makes the IDF look bad.



So with that reasoning we could blame the Soviet Unions repressive regimes on the US?

I lay the blame on the Iranians repressive regime on their leaders desire to forcefully stay in power.



I might get my information from things like actually seeing with my own eyes a group of Hezbollah militia pull a bus full of children up near the Beirut airport and then stand with that bus behind them as they indiscriminately fired automatic weapons and RPG's at US Marines who DID NOT fire one shot in retaliation for fear of hitting a child, however there were a few times the back blast from an RPG did damage the bus and shatter windows.

did you gloss over the videos i posted? did you not see the news report about Israel using Palestinian children as human shields?

Meh.

You lost it Jedd. Hopefully it was just you lost yourself in the argument, but either way, you need to re-examine some things about the way you think. You are veering into the area of radicalism. You have abandoned logic and self examination in favor of Dogma and religious/ethnic nationalism.

Iran is the enemy of freedom. Its brand of Theocracy would enslave people under religious tenets. This is where the argument ends and lines which cannot be crossed are drawn.

Meh.

You lost it Jedd. Hopefully it was just you lost yourself in the argument, but either way, you need to re-examine some things about the way you think. You are veering into the area of radicalism. You have abandoned logic and self examination in favor of Dogma and religious/ethnic nationalism.

Iran is the enemy of freedom. Its brand of Theocracy would enslave people under religious tenets. This is where the argument ends and lines which cannot be crossed are drawn.

What logic is there in the stance that the United States and Israel can do no wrong? Holier then thou 4 life is these peoples mantra.

What logic is there in the stance that the United States and Israel can do no wrong? Holier then thou 4 life is these peoples mantra.

I don't believe that for one second anyone on this board, including Fandros or Akipt, believe that the US and Israel can do no wrong. You rally are losing it Jedd...time to take a break from here.

I don't believe that for one second anyone on this board, including Fandros or Akipt, believe that the US and Israel can do no wrong. You rally are losing it Jedd...time to take a break from here.

It would be very hard to prove otherwise, they not only accept 0 critisism, any argument that even remotely shows that America has done something wrong is met with insults, and childish comparisons to the most bias reporting that they think proves them right.

I'd love to see how Fandros feels about the fact that we care soooooo much about the poor oppressed people of Iran, yet do nothing for the ones dieing daily in Darfur. They expect me to feel sorry for the poor poor little men that were held hostage by Iran for over a year and eventually released, but they have no remorse for the million + Iranians that died with our blessings against Iraq. Holier then thou indeed.

Can you say propoganda?

It actually works against Iran. This isn't the kind of thing political leaders do. It is just so unashamedly, well, shameful.

Facts are facts Jedd ya twit...

The US gives more per capita to the downtrodden then you'd like to believe.

Fock off ya twit, go to Iran and rejoice in the SHINING LIGHT OF THE DESERT...

please...

This little tidbit stood out to me....
Go watch some news Fandros then come talk to me when you know what the fuck you are talking about.

But I thought the news was all censored here in the U.S.? I thought we were only allowed to see what the Administration wanted us to see?

Jedd, the U.S. has its flaws, there's no denying.
However, when compared to Iran, the flaws are almost trivial.

No one in the United States has been imprisoned for speaking their mind.
No one has been killed by the Government due to the sexual preferance they have.
No one in the United States has been put to death by the Government for commiting adultry.

Is the U.S. perfect? No, not by a long shot.
However, remember if you were to live in Iran, and speak as you have against the Government there, you'd get to "spend some time by yourself" for a bit.

I suggest you visit the Middle East, as I have, and see how the situation is, there.
You might have a revelation.

I wonder how if this forum has come up on the FBI radar b/c of Jedd. If he's really what he says he is he is probably being labeled as an enemy of the state :p

Personally I think he's full of it and only tries to goad people into arguing with him b/c he's bored.

The main problem for Jedd is that he's all over the place. There's no single, coherent point he's trying to defend, and his examples and counter-examples take him to the far reaches of the map. Here There Be Non Sequiturs. This sort of thing isn't limited to Jedd (it's a staple of internet debate, really), but all the flailing has muddied the waters and led to much froth.

So, I invite Jedd to try to narrow down his claims to a more singular line of debate. Or people can marvel over Ahmait'stooearlyinthemorningtospellhisnameajad's blog content. Failing all that, I'll send this to the Sandbox.

Be good, lads.

Ohhh, we haven't had a good Sandbox thread in a while....

Facts are facts Jedd ya twit...

The US gives more per capita to the downtrodden then you'd like to believe.

Fock off ya twit, go to Iran and rejoice in the SHINING LIGHT OF THE DESERT...

please...

Actually you are wrong... the US gives the most aid in the world, but it is less per capita then many countries. Get your facts straight.

The problem is I am sitting here posting about a thread, and someone has to derail just to get a rise out of me. So i anwer them, and then someone posts insults directed at me... so i try and answer them and i get blasted with more insults.

I am human, and if half of the things said to me here were said to my face there would have been a fight. Yet here i can only respond with text.

Bottom line is that every post i made here was fact...

America is funding groups to cause unrest in Iran
Israel uses Palestinian children as Human shields

Even when i accept their faults you insult me as if i was saying they do nothing wrong. Reevalutate your debate skills... Baiting me into other subjects and then telling me i am all over the place is BS, you cause it.

Refute my facts... I even posted fucking videos for you that show you the shit I am talking about... I bet $5000000000000000.00 that Fandros and most of you didn't even watch the videos. You won't even accept to research into what i post, yet you think you hold the moral high ground?

Fact is the US is fucked up right now, and is getting more fucked up every day. We bow to the will of AIPAC and the Israeli's and take our tax dollars and give it to those inhumane fucks. Which might i add is an impeachable offense to put the security of Israel over that of our own. I don't care what you think about me, If you cannot accept that one small fact then you are lost.

If the US gives the most aid in the world, who cares if it's not in line with what its GNP percentage is?
Facts are it gives the most ammt of dollars than any government. Combine that with what private organizations donate, and I think you'll find the U.S. falls in line with it's GNP percentage, if not more.

America is funding efforts to destabalize Iran, because, as you said in an earlier post, Iran is our enemy. We don't like the regime there, and will fund any efforts to get them out of power.

On the screw-up scale Iran ranks higher than the U.S. on many fronts.
What you are attempting to do is excuse bad behavior from Iran, by pointing to bad behavior on the U.S.
It's a weak method to use, as it does not address the original issue. It's called redirecting.

Stay on topic. Otherwise you look like a fool, running around all over the place trying to defend 22 positions, all at once.

If the US gives the most aid in the world, who cares if it's not in line with what its GNP percentage is?
Facts are it gives the most ammt of dollars than any government. Combine that with what private organizations donate, and I think you'll find the U.S. falls in line with it's GNP percentage, if not more.

America is funding efforts to destabalize Iran, because, as you said in an earlier post, Iran is our enemy. We don't like the regime there, and will fund any efforts to get them out of power.

On the screw-up scale Iran ranks higher than the U.S. on many fronts.
What you are attempting to do is excuse bad behavior from Iran, by pointing to bad behavior on the U.S.
It's a weak method to use, as it does not address the original issue. It's called redirecting.

Stay on topic. Otherwise you look like a fool, running around all over the place trying to defend 22 positions, all at once.

Alright, i will accept that.

back to a previous statement Jedd, no one here is saying the US can do no wrong, in fact we often point out our own flaws on this board often.

back to a previous statement Jedd, no one here is saying the US can do no wrong, in fact we often point out our own flaws on this board often.

Some of you do, However I have yet to ever see Fandros criticize anything about America other then liberals and that doesn't count. :)

Some of you do, However I have yet to ever see Fandros criticize anything about America other then liberals and that doesn't count. There's more than enough people on this board posting the negatives about America or Bush at the moment. But there's plenty of good too, and that's sorely lacking right now for context. Which is something you really do lack.

If the US gives the most aid in the world, who cares if it's not in line with what its GNP percentage is?
Facts are it gives the most ammt of dollars than any government. Combine that with what private organizations donate, and I think you'll find the U.S. falls in line with it's GNP percentage, if not more.


yea, not really.

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp

There's more than enough people on this board posting the negatives about Iran or Ahmadinejad at the moment. But there's plenty of good too, and that's sorely lacking right now for context. Which is something you really do lack and which I am trying to provide.
------------
Probably Jedd's best possible response. Putting it forth as a bonus to Jedd, kind of like a golfer's handicap.

yea, not really.

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp

Who sends the most food, you know the stuff that actually keeps people alive? I don't know but I suspect the US does, on the other hand It doesn't matter. As long as our country is giving something, whether its not enough or someone else is giving more, doesn't matter to me. Big props to the other countries who give more.

im not saying the US sends nothing, but the "zomg we give so much!" crowd always gets to me.

yea, not really.

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp

You may not like the per capita figures, but if you want to accept these figures on this post, the US gives almost double the second highest giver in total monetary aid on this link.

Where's China? Where's India? Where's Russia? They aren't even on the list per capita or in total amount. India and China with their quickly growing economies aren't giving much aid at all. Where's Iran on this list?

Look at your list, it's basically just Europe and North America (+ Japan). Bad mouth the US Wiggo, have fun. Why don't 100+ other countries in the world give any real measurable aid?

You may not like the per capita figures, but if you want to accept these figures on this post, the US gives almost double the second highest giver in total monetary aid on this link.

Where's China? Where's India? Where's Russia? They aren't even on the list per capita or in total amount. India and China with their quickly growing economies aren't giving much aid at all. Where's Iran on this list?

Look at your list, it's basically just Europe and North America (+ Japan). Bad mouth the US Wiggo, have fun. Why don't 100+ other countries in the world give any real measurable aid?

Just a note regarding Iran in your post... Iran has been under sanctions and embargo's for years, there is no way they could afford to give aid and continue with keeping their country running and building appropriate defenses for the eventual US attack.

im not saying the US sends nothing, but the "zomg we give so much!" crowd always gets to me.

almost 23 BILLION dollars last year. That's not a lot of money? We give more than anyone else in the world, and it's still not enough?

Only 2 countries in the top 10 of population are even on that list, the US (#3) and Japan (#10). It's a lot easier to give higher per capita if you have a smaller population. Sweden has approximately 9 million in population, whereas the US has approx. 303 million in population. The US has 33.9X the number of people of Sweden.

Again, you don't see China, India, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, Bangledesh, Russia, or Nigeria on the list (the other 8 most populated countries that aren't on the foreign aid list you mentioned). Numbers 11,12, 13 are also not on the list, with Germany number 14 strongly on the list. (11 = Mexico, 12= Philippines, 13= Vietnam). One more country in the top 20 in population is on the list (France at number 19).

So lets see, of the worlds top 20 most populated countries, 4 of them are on the list of givers: The United States, Japan, Germany and France. Yes Iran is one of the 20 most populated countries in the world (18th), where's Iran's foreign aid?

I also couldn't tell for sure, but it didn't look like that list took private charitable donations into account either.

almost 23 BILLION dollars last year. That's not a lot of money? We give more than anyone else in the world, and it's still not enough?

Only 2 countries in the top 10 of population are even on that list, the US (#3) and Japan (#10). It's a lot easier to give higher per capita if you have a smaller population. Sweden has approximately 9 million in population, whereas the US has approx. 303 million in population. The US has 33.9X the number of people of Sweden.

Again, you don't see China, India, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, Bangledesh, Russia, or Nigeria on the list (the other 8 most populated countries that aren't on the foreign aid list you mentioned). Numbers 11,12, 13 are also not on the list, with Germany number 14 strongly on the list. (11 = Mexico, 12= Philippines, 13= Vietnam). One more country in the top 20 in population is on the list (France at number 19).

So lets see, of the worlds top 20 most populated countries, 4 of them are on the list of givers: The United States, Japan, Germany and France. Yes Iran is one of the 20 most populated countries in the world (18th), where's Iran's foreign aid?

I also couldn't tell for sure, but it didn't look like that list took private charitable donations into account either.

Did you even read what i posted?

are you fucking retarded? russia china india indonesia brazil pakistan bangladesh russia and nigeria dont give more because THEY ARE POOR. holy shit, you say i bad mouth the US when i was simply stating facts, then ask why the 100+ poor countries out there dont give out measurable aid, hint: they are the ones receiving aid right now.

by god, whining that bangladesh doesnt fork over the aid, boggles the mind.

Jedd,

You don't see me bash or critique the US because you haven't pulled your head out of your ass long enough to do more than lie and bullshit your way from one point to another.

I've constantly critiqued the IRS, bill riders, lobbyists and yes the way we've waged war since WWII.

Imho we should've taken away the insurgents biggest tool....turning hiding amongst the populace into a numbers game instead of a shield.

We bomb their positions , target them primarily but deal with the loss of civilian life as we have in wars prior to the Korean war.

We have pussy footed around with the likes of Iraq and Iran to the point those shit holes think they would stand a chance against us.

Yup, we'd be hated....what's the difference between now and the alternative?

Ahhh and trust me boyo, it wouldn't be a fight for me to say such to your face. While it's your culture and history to lash out/stone/kill/maim when folks disagree with you I have to assume your time here has lead you to avoid situations that end really poorly for ya ;P

You don't see me bash or critique the US because you haven't pulled your head out of your ass long enough to do more than lie and bullshit your way from one point to another.

Accusing me of a lie, but failing to prove such a lie exists is called lieing.

I've constantly critiqued the IRS, bill riders, lobbyists and yes the way we've waged war since WWII.

You have never however critiqued our imperialistic foreign policy nor our alliance with Israel which causes more headache for us then benefit.

Imho we should've taken away the insurgents biggest tool....turning hiding amongst the populace into a numbers game instead of a shield.

Unfortunately someone like you cannot comprehend that when you are being attacked by the most powerful army in the world, you do not stand in the street with a uniform on and fight. If the roles were reversed you would truly see how idiotic some of your beliefs are.

We bomb their positions , target them primarily but deal with the loss of civilian life as we have in wars prior to the Korean war.

In a war against "terrorism" the more civilians that die, the closer you get to losing. You still do not comprehend such a simple fact. If we bombed them without taking loss of civilian life into consideration, you would soon see the same bombings that take place in Israel happening in the US, in busses and subways and such.

Have you ever wondered why it is done to the Israeli's? because to them every Palestinian is the enemy. They fight the way you are thinking we should fight, and they get the sting of reprisal.

We have pussy footed around with the likes of Iraq and Iran to the point those shit holes think they would stand a chance against us.

I don't know how you think you can even speak about these subjects when you do not even know anything about Iran... A shithole? Iran is a beautiful country with modern city's, Ski resorts, modern rail transport, and a civilian population that is family oriented much like Mexican families.

Yup, we'd be hated....what's the difference between now and the alternative?

The difference is that right now there are extreme people that think we target civilians, and there are moderate people that still think we are wrong but that we do not target civilians purposely, However if we continue down the road you choose, what makes us different then any other person who kills innocents?


Ahhh and trust me boyo, it wouldn't be a fight for me to say such to your face. While it's your culture and history to lash out/stone/kill/maim when folks disagree with you I have to assume your time here has lead you to avoid situations that end really poorly for ya ;P

There is your ignorance once again shining through... My culture and history to lash out stone, kill and maim?

I was raised by Iranian parents who taught me to love all life, and to respect people. I have never picked a fight unless i believed it was the right thing to do in defense of something i believed in or someone i cared about. You are used to mindless generalizations because it is what you are fed daily and you cannot comprehend that the world is different then you see on your television or from what your superiors tell you.

Why the fuck do you think I sit here and stand against US aggression? Do you think it is fun being in an unpopular situation such as mine to have to defend my beliefs against brainwashed lemmings?

I am also a man and would not take your childish insults which you prefer over actual civilized discussion if you were standing before me. You are not above me because you were a soldier. You simply killed more people in your life then me, and I can accept my fate when I am judged before god as an old man.

I was raised by Iranian parents who taught me to love all life, and to respect people. I have never picked a fight unless i believed it was the right thing to do in defense of something i believed in or someone i cared about. You are used to mindless generalizations because it is what you are fed daily and you cannot comprehend that the world is different then you see on your television or from what your superiors tell you.

Who when they (your parents) had no country they came to the place that would welcome them with open arms and a fair chance at a new life. Your parents were obviously not supporters of Ayatollah Khomeini otherwise they had no reason to leave Iran.


Why the fuck do you think I sit here and stand against US aggression? Do you think it is fun being in an unpopular situation such as mine to have to defend my beliefs against brainwashed lemmings?

You are allowed to believe what you believe in the US Jedd, unlike in Iran, but can't you show some appreciation for the country that took your family in when in all probability they were going to be at the very least arrested or most likely tortured then killed by the Ayatollah's regime?

Like Fandros said we can all speak out against our government and it's agencies, we can also speak out against the President and any other elected or appointed official. Is that allowed in Iran?

Here is your shit hole Iran...

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/28/578/570.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/25/557/539.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/11/579/53.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/7/235/417.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/28/132/280.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/13/420/551.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/27/604/185.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/28/8/69.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/13/431/390.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/20/227/166.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/7/235/412.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/29/9/465.jpg


http://www.worldisround.com/photos/7/283/242.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/6/39/273.jpg

http://i1.trekearth.com/photos/38865/farmaniyeh.jpg

what a shithole indeed...

Here is your shit hole Iran...

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/28/578/570.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/29/9/465.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/27/171/490.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/22/221/109.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/28/138/412.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/7/330/352.jpg
http://www.worldisround.com/photos/12/140/368.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/28/132/280.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/7/235/407.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/7/283/242.jpg

http://www.worldisround.com/photos/6/39/273.jpg

what a shithole indeed...

Looks very blue and white to me.

Who when they (your parents) had no country they came to the place that would welcome them with open arms and a fair chance at a new life. Your parents were obviously not supporters of Ayatollah Khomeini otherwise they had no reason to leave Iran.




You are allowed to believe what you believe in the US Jedd, unlike in Iran, but can't you show some appreciation for the country that took your family in when in all probability they were going to be at the very least arrested or most likely tortured then killed by the Ayatollah's regime?

Like Fandros said we can all speak out against our government and it's agencies, we can also speak out against the President and any other elected or appointed official. Is that allowed in Iran?

My parents were nowhere near being arrested or punished... where do you get this bullshit?

My dad came to America and attended college, and was joined later by his father, mother, and Sister because his parents missed him and thought that instead of waiting for him to finish and come back they would move there to be with him...

Believe it or not, you can leave Iran whenever you want, it isn't like Iraq was.

The simple fact that out of everything i typed, you had this to say, shows how horribly brainwashed Americans are about the outside world.

Damnit... here is the link to the site with all the pictures. I edited out the non hostable pictures.

http://www.worldisround.com/articles/98910/

My parents were nowhere near being arrested or punished... where do you get this bullshit?

My dad came to America and attended college, and was joined later by his father, mother, and Sister because his parents missed him and thought that instead of waiting for him to finish and come back they would move there to be with him...

Believe it or not, you can leave Iran whenever you want, it isn't like Iraq was.

The simple fact that out of everything i typed, you had this to say, shows how horribly brainwashed Americans are about the outside world.

Pretty funny, I happen to know someone who postson this board that is also Iranian, you're not the only one.

I gotta say, you are amazing that scenario of why your parents are here is truly creative.

Pretty funny, I happen to know someone who postson this board that is also Iranian, you're not the only one.

I gotta say, you are amazing that scenario of why your parents are here is truly creative.

It is actually the truth, my parents left before the Revolution.

Damnit... here is the link to the site with all the pictures. I edited out the non hostable pictures.

http://www.worldisround.com/articles/98910/


WOW...some damn nice targets in those pictures!!!

WOW...some damn nice targets in those pictures!!!

wow...

what do pictures prove i can show you some beautiful pictures of detroit, but its still the worst city in the damn country.

Pictures are as jaded as history.

I've heard it is a very beautiful country, however you can put a dress on a pile of poo and it'll still stink to high heaven of shit.

what do pictures prove i can show you some beautiful pictures of detroit, but its still the worst city in the damn country.

Pictures are as jaded as history.

You won't ever go there right? So here are pictures of the shithole.

How one can look at these people and think that bombing them is the right thing to do is insane. Especially assclowns like Fandros who want to just forget about Civilian casualties... He just wants us to say "Fuck It" and take care of em... There is no humanity left in people that support these types of actions, and if you think that we can interfere to make Iran more free to its people, you are dead wrong.

Iran needs to reach freedom by itself, just like we did. Iran needs to make its own moves to remove whatever oppression they feel is unjust.

I am tired of hearing the same shit about Iran as i heard about Iraq... It is not our job to change their government, it is theirs.

It's also not Iran's job to build IED's for insurgents in Iraq, but they are doing a bang up job of doing so.

I just want to return the favor, not target the populace so much as the factors in Iran that's holding them back.

Boy when you understand why the US does such an awful job waging wars nowdays we'll speak further on big boy topics.

War should be feared and reviled, war should leave a bad taste in your mouth for generations...

This pissing about and kissing babies for PR is making it far too easy to rush in again and again.

It's also not Iran's job to build IED's for insurgents in Iraq, but they are doing a bang up job of doing so.

I just want to return the favor, not target the populace so much as the factors in Iran that's holding them back.

Boy when you understand why the US does such an awful job waging wars nowdays we'll speak further on big boy topics.

War should be feared and reviled, war should leave a bad taste in your mouth for generations...

This pissing about and kissing babies for PR is making it far too easy to rush in again and again.

The problem is that the evidence you have for Iran building IED's is the government... Do you not accept that the US tries to sell wars by demonizing our enemy?

What does Iran have to gain from an unstable Iraq? Nothing.

I know full well why the US is doing such a bad job in the wars we are participating in, it is because there is a big muzzle on the military that will not allow it to go all out and just swiftly do its job.

It is all about public opinion. The only way the US can ever lose an all out war in this world is when it loses the backing of its own people. I am no fool Fandros.

The problem is that this Administration has proven that it lied, and will lie to get what it wants, and I see you and many others just accepting what they are telling you and i wonder why?

The Afghan president sais Iran is doing nothing but helping them in their country... The Iraqi leader is saying the exact same thing. That Iran is a positive force in Iraq's rebuilding. The only people crying foul are the US government, and you are telling me that I should just believe them like you?

Sorry Fandros, no matter how much you think you know more then me, And I am sure as a 42 year old man there is a lot of it, I cannot accept that you are right in this.

are you fucking retarded? russia china india indonesia brazil pakistan bangladesh russia and nigeria dont give more because THEY ARE POOR. holy shit, you say i bad mouth the US when i was simply stating facts, then ask why the 100+ poor countries out there dont give out measurable aid, hint: they are the ones receiving aid right now.

by god, whining that bangladesh doesnt fork over the aid, boggles the mind.

You completely missed my point. You are basing the United States aid based upon per capita figures. Inherantly it's harder to give higher % of GDP when you have a larger population. Your complete point was our per capita figure when we have the 3rd highest population in the world. Comparing that to a country with 9 million people is apples to oranges.

I don't know how you think you can even speak about these subjects when you do not even know anything about Iran... A shithole? Iran is a beautiful country with modern city's, Ski resorts, modern rail transport, and a civilian population that is family oriented much like Mexican families.



But they are too poor to give any foreign aid...

much like Mexican families.

So what you are saying is the Iranians are good fruit and vegetable pickers?

You completely missed my point. You are basing the United States aid based upon per capita figures. Inherantly it's harder to give higher % of GDP when you have a larger population. Your complete point was our per capita figure when we have the 3rd highest population in the world. Comparing that to a country with 9 million people is apples to oranges.

fine, compare EU to US

Timothy Garton Ash would probably not dissent from much of the preceding analysis. In his engaging new book he actually goes further than Rifkin and Reid in certain respects. As an international citizen, he notes, the Uni-ted States is irresponsibly delinquent. The EU gave away $36.5 billion in development aid in 2003. The US managed just one third that amount—and much of that foreign aid either went to Israel or else came with strings attached: nearly 80 percent of all American "development aid" obliges recipients to spend the money on American goods and services. On Iraq alone the US spent eight times the amount it gave in overseas aid to everyone else. The US is the meanest of all the rich countries on the OECD's Development Assistance Committee. The Europeans are by far the most generous.

bolding mine.

Wiggo, I'm not sure where you're going with this. Are you saying that we're pretty damn awesome, or just mostly awesome, or...?

Interesting, a conglomeration of countries outgave our single one.

/bravo?

fine, compare EU to US


Ok according to your first post, the US gave 16+billion in aid. The final thing you quoted basically says we gave 12 billion in aid in 2003. So now we know we can't trust the either set of figures you linked since they aren't even remotely close.

Also the EU has approx 500 million in population compared to 300 million in the US.

Also again, your EU figures don't show how much of that EU aid went to other EU countries. To even try to debate what you are attempting to debate, you need to at least provide some figures for that. That's relavant because the US figures don't include domestic monies here. If you compare the EU to the US in this manner, you are comparing them as a unit/country. Any EU money that doesn't leave the EU wouldn't be foreign aid the way you are trying to compare the two.

Ok according to your first post, the US gave 16+billion in aid. The final thing you quoted basically says we gave 12 billion in aid in 2003. So now we know we can't trust the either set of figures you linked since they aren't even remotely close.

Also the EU has approx 500 million in population compared to 300 million in the US.

Also again, your EU figures don't show how much of that EU aid went to other EU countries. To even try to debate what you are attempting to debate, you need to at least provide some figures for that. That's relavant because the US figures don't include domestic monies here. If you compare the EU to the US in this manner, you are comparing them as a unit/country. Any EU money that doesn't leave the EU wouldn't be foreign aid the way you are trying to compare the two.

first of all, inter-eu aid is all part of the eu budget and has nothing to do with these figures. second of all, im too tired to go compile the rich eu countries to the US in terms of aid % of gdi, population etc right now. also, i think the second think i quoted only includes development aid, removing for example israel from the equation.

fandros, for the love of helmut, what do you want to compare the US with? if i compare you to singular eu countries, you whine that you are larger, if i compare you to all of eu, you whine and say its multiple countries....

I think simply acknowledging that the US gives an exorbitant amount of aid to the world would suffice.

if you by exorbitant mean exorbitantly small in comparison to, say, sweden, then i have no problem acknowledging this.

Wiggo how many multinational corporations are based in Sweden, in comparison to, say, the United States? Microsoft's charitable giving alone is probably bigger than that of Sweden.

One thing that you may have missed is that international police keeping generally falls largely on the shoulders of the United States. Our citizens get taxed about the same as yours, yet nearly two thirds of our federal taxes go to the Department of Defense. You have a standing military of about 15,000 for 9 million citizens. Ultimately, you are comparing apples to automobiles.

Just because the government doesn't give doesn't mean there isn't charitable giving from the United States to the rest of the world. After the Tsunami hit the US Red Cross led the way in rebuilding. US organizations have been throughout the 3rd world rebuilding since the countries foundation. The government is doing its own thing as well, and thats not so bad.

they have nokia!

Euro jackass. All Wiggo does is come to this forum and spew his hate for America. I don't know why he even bothers coming here. Hell I couldn't stand the douche when I played EQ 5+ years ago.

Euro jackass. All Wiggo does is come to this forum and spew his hate for America. I don't know why he even bothers coming here. Hell I couldn't stand the douche when I played EQ 5+ years ago.

I guess i just hate freedom that much. :confused:

grey, Nokia=finland, Ericsson=sweden ffs!

Nevermind I am ornory!

Euro jackass. All Wiggo does is come to this forum and spew his hate for America. I don't know why he even bothers coming here. Hell I couldn't stand the douche when I played EQ 5+ years ago.

Jesus are you so intolerant? Why is it that anyone who questions anything about America is automatically labeled Anti American, or a Hater of America?

You sound like all the Israeli's who cry Anti-Semetism the moment anyone disagree's with them... Grow up

It gets old after a while, after all he's been posting stabs at anything America since 2002.
He has yet to come up with a topic about anything BUT. He is obvisouly brain washed much like yourself. Like I said before who cares about IRAN...I sure don't.

It gets old after a while, after all he's been posting stabs at anything America since 2002.
He has yet to come up with a topic about anything BUT. He is obvisouly brain washed much like yourself. Like I said before who cares about IRAN...I sure don't.

We seem to have a very different opinion on who is brainwashed... I prefer to believe that those who obey without question are the brainwashed ones... He simply pointed out that they were wrong with their calculation that America gave the most aid per capita, and he gets bashed.

Tell me how someone Born in America living here all his life(me) gets brainwashed into disagreeing, and questioning America?.... Thats right, you can't lemming.

He was shown his data was bullshit. Thats right, you lack reading comprehension.

Let me remind you of the type of person you are:

Listen bitch... You are a nobody in this world... I live in Los Angeles, fuck your women, enjoy my life shitting on people like you daily.

Talk shit all day long... the US is Afraid of Iran you fuckin idiot... You think the US has ever let any country shit on us more then Iran has without attacking them?

Fuck you... Iran is the light shining in the desert, the only fuckin country in the world that has the fuckin balls to stand up to us... You are nobody... Go watch some American Idol bitch.


Hmm interesting. So when you said "Your women"..did you mean US women or were you ethically speaking? ...don't talk to me little one.

He was shown his data was bullshit. Thats right, you lack reading comprehension.

Let me remind you of the type of person you are:



Hmm interesting. So when you said "Your women"..did you mean US women or were you ethically speaking? ...don't talk to me little one.

Wow lol thats the best you got? Mind answering the question? How does someone born in the United States get brainwashed against the generic public opinion?

Those who question everything are resistant the most to brainwashing... lemming.

Anyways I am done posting on this thread as it has derailed so far from where it began, I will just leave this thread with one last thing... This is Iran's reaction after 9/11 and from the words of Americans what they did to help us.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWJiRNYOrGY


Peace!

grey, Nokia=finland, Ericsson=sweden ffs!

same place....

Taleren can you put a vbookie bet for Jedd posting in this thread again..

Why? You wouldn't get very good odds...

Oh I can almost wager myself that Jedd will be back to tell me how he "fucks your women" again and again.

Tho the thought is laughable, she'd not give the lil whiner 2 cents let alone a snog and wink.

She has lil patience for those that bite at the nipple of freedom while drinking deep of it's tasty draught...

We seem to have a very different opinion on who is brainwashed... I prefer to believe that those who obey without question are the brainwashed ones... He simply pointed out that they were wrong with their calculation that America gave the most aid per capita, and he gets bashed.

Tell me how someone Born in America living here all his life(me) gets brainwashed into disagreeing, and questioning America?.... Thats right, you can't lemming.

The original mention of America being charitable did not specify per capita; that was tossed in by folks after the fact, when the pissing contest had already started.

And Jedd, you are coming across as "brainwashed", if that is the term we are going to use; you are adamant about your positions and accuse others of intolerance when they attack your opinions and beliefs.....ummm, almost like those folks in Israel.

While you have started out with some interesting points, you devolve to the type of arguments I would assume I would hear from the Imam at a prayer meeting. You accuse folks of using soundbites from Fox news and such media, but your points are also sounding like much the same, albeit from a different media source.

This thread is going nowhere. Even the derail has now mirrored the original topic and is just folks pointing fingers saying "neener neener".....nobody is going to win any arguments in this thread because this is not a debate. We have all shared our opinions and then someone else has attacked those beliefs, and shared their opposing views, which were then attacked , and so on and so on and so on. The attacks are not even showing much originality anymore.

The gist of what I am picking up from your posts tho', Jedd, is that you would be more content fighting against America than being a part of it. I have yet to hear how you intend to try to make changes within the system so I can only infer you are not willing to take action based upon the beliefs you have shared. It may well be that Fandros' suggestion is the best option: move to Iran. With your mind set, it truly appears that woud suit you best; or, get involved politically and try to do something about that which you have attacked here and elsewhere.

/gasp, Grey, that was a terrible thing to say.

My Mother's side was Swedish, and when she took a Finn for her second husband, she was almost disowned. There is not a lot of love there.

finland used to be our bitches...in fact they still are when it comes to hockey!

She has lil patience for those that bite at the nipple of freedom while drinking deep of it's tasty draught...

The problem is biting the nipple when sometimes a few little flicks of....nevermind....wrong board.

She has lil patience for those that bite at the nipple of freedom while drinking deep of it's tasty draught...I think Jedd needs to be bottle fed his freedom.

Haha :D

Jedd's comments on the Rep hit gives insights to his true nature.
Like many Middle Eastern men, he smiles in your face, and tries to stab you in the back.
The few good insights he has given to certain subjects are outweighed by his Anti-American/Pro-Iranian stance.
Wiggo is the typical euro-trash, completely oblivious as to why this so called United States is considered to be a great country. Sweden must be a better place, because that's where he lives! :confused:


Even the loose cannons, hit the mark every so often. Too bad they generally do more damage to thier cause when they happen to miss.....

Like many Middle Eastern men, he smiles in your face, and tries to stab you in the back.

Most huh? So that would be like 51% of Middle Eastern men smile in your face while trying to stab you in the back? Or is it close to 90%?

Many =| Most by definition

If you're gonna use a stupid mathmatical symbol instead of a word, you should probably at least use one that really means "not equal to".

Let me help ya out: ~=, !=, =/=, <>

I've met only a few hundred Middle Eastern men in my lifetime so I'm not the best barometer, but I've never been stabbed in the back. Its a glaringly over exagerated stereotype at best.

=/\~>!<~/\=

If you're gonna use a stupid mathmatical symbol instead of a word, you should probably at least use one that really means "not equal to".

Let me help ya out: ~=, !=, =/=, <>

I've met only a few hundred Middle Eastern men in my lifetime so I'm not the best barometer, but I've never been stabbed in the back. Its a glaringly over exagerated stereotype at best.

If your going to be an asshole to Sixee, at least have some proper reading comprehension. So I put the bar after the = instead before it. Big deal. I thought most people on this board figured out how pointless it is to attack someone's grammar or spelling, otherwise we'd spend all day correcting others' their/they're/there, etc.

Fine you don't like the sentiment of his statement, but it doesn't help your argument at all when you have to put words into his mouth that he didn't say. Attack his idea, not him. Attack his words, don't attribute words to him that he didn't say. It makes the rest of your post worthless when the first few words incorrectly attribute a certain statement to someone who didn't say it.

Or I can attack you instead of your ideas like you are prone to do here. Here's an example...

It's no surprise that you would put words in his mouth that he didn't specifically say seeing as how you work in the media.

Many is one of those terms that is non-specific.
I can say many people like ice cream, and not be wrong, because I haven't given a specific number.
Considering what a pissing contest this place turns into when someone posts actual numbers, I decided to use a little "softer" approach.

Maybe the many --> most switch was an attempt to be "Fair and Balanced".....

Kelraz, how many of those men were smiling at you?

I do find it interesting that no one jumped to Wiggo's defense, though....LOL

I've met only a few hundred Middle Eastern men in my lifetime so I'm not the best barometer, but I've never been stabbed in the back. Its a glaringly over exagerated stereotype at best.

Few hundred? Wow your amazing, I bet this was when you were dating that double agent in the FBI?

Few hundred? Wow your amazing, I bet this was when you were dating that double agent in the FBI?

You've never traveled? I spent a week in Israel in college (and even raided Ssra from a net cafe there), attended a film festival in Istanbul, and most recently spent a week in Morocco for work. Besides this city is pretty damn international, I'm sure Ainwein has quite a few Middle Eastern classmates like I did when I went to AU.

My ex-girlfriend Kate used to be in the Army before her discharge which that thread was about I believe. My best friend Brendan works for the FBI, currently stationed in Cambodia, which was probably a seperate thread. Is it that unreasonable that people who live in the city where the FBI is headquartered and the Pentagon is located might know people who work there? I mean Langley is right around the corner from my house ... these places happen to actually exist outside of novels and movies. You might want to give that a rest already?

Point remaining, I think its an untrue stereotype that Middle Eastern men would backstab any more than anyone else. Look at most of the corruption and backstabbing in this country, and it looks to tend to be more white guys - but I wouldn't even stereotype that way either.

first of all sixee, youre an utter twat. second, i think sweden is a better place than your 'great country' because it is.

Touche, point taken (to Kelraz)!

And you prove my point, deliciously, Wiggo.
It's "better" because you think it's so.
No regards for an opinion, other than your own.

How incredibly "open-minded".

You've never traveled? I spent a week in Israel in college (and even raided Ssra from a net cafe there), attended a film festival in Istanbul, and most recently spent a week in Morocco for work. Besides this city is pretty damn international, I'm sure Ainwein has quite a few Middle Eastern classmates like I did when I went to AU.

My ex-girlfriend Kate used to be in the Army before her discharge which that thread was about I believe. My best friend Brendan works for the FBI, currently stationed in Cambodia, which was probably a seperate thread. Is it that unreasonable that people who live in the city where the FBI is headquartered and the Pentagon is located might know people who work there? I mean Langley is right around the corner from my house ... these places happen to actually exist outside of novels and movies. You might want to give that a rest already?

Point remaining, I think its an untrue stereotype that Middle Eastern men would backstab any more than anyone else. Look at most of the corruption and backstabbing in this country, and it looks to tend to be more white guys - but I wouldn't even stereotype that way either.

While all possible I am still pretty sure you said your girlfriend was an agent. I really don't care enough to look it up but it does ring a bell :)

no, again, it is better because it is better. please do show me how your great country is better than mine, if you want to.

A simple googling of the phrase 'swedish girl' will provide quick and undeniable evidence of their superiority.

No regards for an opinion, other than your own.
You can start here Sixee:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Development_Index

They left out the "Invading Other Countries" index so I am sure the U.S. is a few places up the list.


Cheers,

Like many Middle Eastern men, he smiles in your face, and tries to stab you in the back.

This is retarded. So was your attempt to rationalize it. If I said something this asinine about black people, even the GOP nuts would realize that it's entirely out of line.

Considering what a pissing contest this place turns into when someone posts actual numbers, I decided to use a little "softer" approach.

Please, PLEASE post these "numbers." Numbers on what? Is there a national survey on how many people have been 'stabbed in the back' by Middle Eastern men?

This kind of shit is why the Republicans are going to get destroyed in this election. I'm mortified that I voted for Bush in '04, and this kind of shit (Not just relegated to these boards. Sixee would fit in great on Fox News) has completely eliminated the chance that I would even consider voting GOP in the upcoming election.

You absolutely demonize Jedd, yet if you review his posts, he actually tries to make sense of the politics of it all. It would be interesting to see a comparison of how many times you, Fandros, Osg, Akipt, and whoever else call him retarded, twat, and so on, compared to how many times he made personal attacks on you. I can guarentee you it's not even close. Jedd could make his arguments in a classroom, and most would probably disagree with him. You come in and say shit like this? Even the freshmen are going to laugh you out of the building.

A simple googling of the phrase 'swedish girl' will provide quick and undeniable evidence of their superiority.

http://www.swedishmodels.net/dtswe0101.htm

mmmmmmmmmmm hmmmmmmmm

http://www.swedishmodels.net/dtswe0101.htm

mmmmmmmmmmm hmmmmmmmm

And Once Again I point out The Other side of Sweden!

http://www.netmediazone.com/bc/ivanhenrys.jpg

Notice the resemblance to jabba the hut of the guy on the far right.

Second from the right looks like a young Dan Akroyd.

Guy in the middle looks like a high school teacher

Second from the left looks like the kid that tortured frogs in your neighborhood

Guy on the far left always has that surprised look on his face.

Not nearly as scary as the Gert Jonnys

And Once Again I point out The Other side of Sweden!

http://www.netmediazone.com/bc/ivanhenrys.jpg


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!

My Eyes! I CAN'T SEE!

And one reason my country is "better" Wiggo, is because we don't allow people like those in the picture above become national singing sensations....

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!

My Eyes! I CAN'T SEE!

And one reason my country is "better" Wiggo, is because we don't allow people like those in the picture above become national singing sensations....

...

http://www.entertainmenthouston.com/acts/bands/fab5/FabHELP1.gif

See? I knew I could get him to post again!
+ Rep to Sixee!!!!!

they are not national singing sensations, and if you seriously believe that, youre stupid in a post-elren kind of way.

you are aware that you can actually measure how a country fares in standard of living, healthcare, education and so forth? and im sad to say, your country is slacking =(

Hey why don't you share with us "Your" standard of living. I'd be willing to hear about it.

Hey why don't you share with us "Your" standard of living. I'd be willing to hear about it.

They make some damn tasty meatballs!

They make some damn tasty meatballs!

sadly, we have to use most of them to feed the roaming polar bears, lest they feast upon human flesh.

sadly, we have to use most of them to feed the roaming polar bears, lest they feast upon human flesh.

Why not feed them Norwegians?

Had some swedish meatballs and lefse just the other day. Always some good swedish food around at the holidays. :)

Try This it's easy and really good!

Gravlax (Cured Salmon)
1 Cup Sugar
1/2 Cup Kosher Salt
2 TBSP cracked white peppercorns
2-3 lb skin on Salmon Filet in one piece (Try to Get Sushi Grade Salmon)
2-3 large bunches of Fresh dill - Coarsely chopped including stems

Place Sugar, Salt and White Peppercorns in a bowl and mix well.

Rub a handful of the mixture into both sides of the fish. Sprinkle the remaining mixture over the Salmon and cover with the Dill. Let stand in a cool spot for 6 hours and then place in refrigerator for at least 36 hours to cure. Scrape the seasoning off of the Salmon before serving, slice on the bias into very thin slices serve with mustard sauce and bread.

To Make Mustard Sauce:

2 TBSP Honey Mustard
1 TSP Dijon Mustard
2 TSP Sugar
1 1/2 TBSP White Wine Vinegar
1 TBSP Cold STRONG Coffee
Pinch of Salt preferably Kosher or Sea Salt
Pinch of Fresh Ground Black Pepper
3/4 Cup Grapeseed or Canola Oil
1/2 Cup Fresh Dill

Take All ingredients except Oil and dill and place in blender. With Blender running slowly add the oil and blend well.

Place in bowl and stir in Dill. Let stand minimum 6 hours - prefer at least 24 hours to blend flavors.

Place slices on whole grain or good rye type bread and small amount of Mustard sauce.

If you like seafood this rocks!!


/derail off!

Always looking for new recipes for salmon, and will give this a try.


And which derail were you derailing from? :D

Always looking for new recipes for salmon, and will give this a try.


And which derail were you derailing from? :D

I was derailing from the derail that previously derailed the other derail!!:eek:

Anyhow...Try this one...it rocks!

Broiled Salmon with AB's Spice Pomade
1/3 cup canola oil, plus 2 teaspoons for sheet pan
1 side of salmon (approximately 3 pounds), pin bones removed
1 1/2 teaspoons kosher salt
1 teaspoon fresh ground black pepper
1 tablespoon whole coriander, toasted
1 tablespoon whole fennel seed, toasted
1 teaspoon whole cumin seed, toasted
1 whole star anise pod
2 teaspoons onion powder
1 teaspoon garlic powder
1/2 teaspoon cayenne pepper

Rub sheet pan with the 2 teaspoons of oil and place side of salmon in pan. Salt and pepper salmon. Set aside.

Add coriander, fennel seed, cumin seed, star anise, onion powder, garlic powder and cayenne pepper to a blender. Turn blender on high and process until whole spices become powder. With blender running, pour in 1/3 cup canola oil and blend until well combined. Stop blender to brush down sides of container, if necessary.

Brush salmon with spice mixture. Allow salmon to sit at room temperature for 30 minutes.

Preheat oven to the high broiler setting. Place salmon in the oven 6-inches from broiler. Cook until salmon reaches an internal temperature of 131 degrees F. This will take approximately 15 minutes, but will vary with different ovens. Remove from oven and let rest for 10 minutes, and then serve immediately. Note that the internal temperature of the fish will a rise a little as carry-over cooking occurs.

Let's see Sweden get to 400 million people and have something that remotely resembles a diverse population before we start the measuring. Hmmm?

Compare yourself to Japan. Thats apples to apples. Comparing yourself to the US is Apples to Jetliners.

Thank you L2!

Let's see Sweden get to 400 million people and have something that remotely resembles a diverse population before we start the measuring. Hmmm?

Compare yourself to Japan. Thats apples to apples. Comparing yourself to the US is Apples to Jetliners.

I am gonna kinda disagree with this though. Would we have a better "quality of living" if we didn't have Black or Hispanic people living here? We have a higher GDP Per capita than Sweden, we simply opted to have a larger military presence in the world than to be isolationists but at the expense of education and healthcare.

Our rich are generally richer than those of Sweden, our middle class are generally richer than those of Sweden, its our poor who are below the Swedish counterparts.

But that being said, we can't get rid of our military. Its a huge fucking expense that Sweden never has to dream of dealing with because we have it taken care of. Instead of hugging up to the Hitlers of the world for safety (as Sweden did during WW2), we are the ones who are willing to stand up against them when necessary for the benefit of all - Sweden included. Iraq is still heavily under debate so I won't use that as an example, but if any modern day country rose up and started taking countries over with force Sweden wouldn't be stepping up to stop them from taking over Sweden and the rest of the world - but the US would be.

Somewhat back on topic sort of, here (http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22935702-2,00.html) we have "Ask Ayman." Al-Qaeda 2nd in command, Ayman al-Zawahri, has invited supporters to send in questions, which he'll answer in an online video next month. I wonder if he knows any good recipes.

I am gonna kinda disagree with this though. Would we have a better "quality of living" if we didn't have Black or Hispanic people living here?

Its not a racial thing. It is simply that developed nations with a more heterogeneous population tend to be more ordered. Governments can work more closely and comfortably with the people in a place like sweden due not to similarities of skin tone, but a universality and commonality of values, outlook, a shared history and a stronger sense of nationalism/patriotism.

i wouldnt say our population is heterogeneous at all, in fact i think we accept the most refugees of any EU country, but even acknowledging this, wouldnt successful integration into these values and norms be a meter of success?

not really, because in the end there isnt the huge culture shock across the EU as say compared to a asian immigrant coming to the US.

I don't know what it's like in Sweden, but in the US it's considered racist to think that everyone that comes here should change their culture to fit into the 'norm.' Therefore, no, I don't think that is a reasonable measure of success.

not changing their culture, but accepting the values of the society they are joining, and integrating themselves into it is what i meant.

grey, i said refugees, not immigrants from other EU countries =D

With so many different cultures in the US, there is no single set of accepted values. Values can often be very varied based upon the society. Trying to convert a person from another country from one value system to another value system isn't cut and dry when there are already so many other cultures each with a different value system in place in the US.

YOU MUST BE SWEDISH you smelly Polish,English,ect immigrant. After all we are the supreme culture of all things great@@!!!!

i wouldnt say our population is heterogeneous at all, in fact i think we accept the most refugees of any EU country, but even acknowledging this, wouldnt successful integration into these values and norms be a meter of success?

Wiggo, you still never addressed my points. If someone like Hitler rose up again your country would probably ally with them once again in order to prevent a fight OR rely on a country like the United States to get you out of the mess. You're still very helpless on your own.

Unless the Hitler comes from the US (not saying it's like that now, don't read that much into it)

Hitler's been referenced in this thread, it's officially over!!

look, when you start off your question by asking if were going to re-ally with hitler, im not going to answer it, because we were never allied with hitler. back to school, buddy.

I'll have to combine the sentiments from Kelraz and L2 here and morph it into an analogy I think fits for countries like Sweden.

They are like big ole fragile snow globes with their own perfect homoginized cultures.

All well and good and nigh perfect, just don't drop the globe or introduce too much change and all is well.

Me, I couldn't live in a country that knows it would have to be saved at each sign of military conflict.

But perhaps that's just the barbarian in me, I'm happy to have served to help protect that beautiful snow globe!!

look, when you start off your question by asking if were going to re-ally with hitler, im not going to answer it, because we were never allied with hitler. back to school, buddy.

Doing some research, you are indeed correct and I was wrong from what I remembered of World History back in high school. They didn't outright ally themselves with Nazi Germany ... however:

The Swedish government felt that it was in no position to openly contest Germany,[25] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden#_note-NB313-319) and therefore collaborated with Hitler.[26] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden#_note-17) Swedish volunteers in Nazi SS units were among the first to invade the Soviet Union (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union) in Operation Barbarossa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Barbarossa). Sweden also supplied steel and machined parts to Germany throughout the war. Towards the end of the war however, when the defeat of Germany seemed imminent, Sweden began to play a role in humanitarian efforts and many refugees, among them many Jews from Nazi-occupied Europe, were saved partly because of the Swedish involvement in rescue missions at the internment camps and partly because Sweden served as a haven for refugees, primarily from Norden (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_countries) and the Baltic states (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baltic_states).[25] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden#_note-NB313-319) Nevertheless, internal and external critics have argued that Sweden could have done more to resist the Nazi war effort, even if risking occupation.[25] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden#_note-NB313-319)

That aside, your country has these great benefits you boast about because you rely on others to protect you and do your international peace keeping (Britain, the United States, etc). You shouldn't be so quick to jump on those who you rely on so dearly.
[/url][url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden#_note-NB313-319"] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweden#_note-NB313-319)

well, when its utterly impossible for us as a nation to single handedly do anything if "another hitler would arise", you cant expect us to do anything on our own, can you?

our military used to be only for defense, but we have shifted heavily towards UN peacekeeping missions, like the one we are currently assisting in afghanistan, and numerous others in africa, the balcans etc.

to answer your original question, i would assume we wouldnt do anything until sanctioned by the UN, or if any aggression towards the EU would take place, as we have an EU-wide mutual defense pact (unsure of name) going on.

by the way, for a country that 'has to be saved at each sign of military conflict' i guess its a miracle no one has saved us yet, isnt it?

Sweden reminds me of the pacifist character in the John Wayne western "The Undefeated".

He was shunned by both Yankees and Rebels for not fighting in the Civil War, because he "didn't want to get shot at."

Wiggo, what you don't understand is accepting refugees doesn't make up for supplying the Nazis. It makes Sweden look like a limp noodle, going along with whatever keeps the largest country off of its back at any given point in time.

i would assume we wouldnt do anything until sanctioned by the UN

Way to stand on your own two feet there....

Wiggo, what you don't understand is accepting refugees doesn't make up for supplying the Nazis. It makes Sweden look like a limp noodle, going along with whatever keeps the largest country off of its back at any given point in time.

why are you constantly making shit up? i never said it 'made up for supplying the nazis' you fucking idiot. i am aware that sweden was pretty shady during ww2, but what would you have done in our place?

Way to stand on your own two feet there....

yes, your tactic of invading everyone is working so much better, is it not?

what would you have done in our place? When the commies invaded us, we went WOLVERINE! on their asses.

why are you constantly making shit up? i never said it 'made up for supplying the nazis' you fucking idiot. i am aware that sweden was pretty shady during ww2, but what would you have done in our place??

Ahh kill the Germans, much like we did? Thats right, once a pussy, always a pussy.

great red dawn reference!

because we really had the military power to invade germany? wtf are you smoking dude?

Wiggo, Sweden didn't have to invade anyone, there's a third option, believe it or not....
It's called resistance, and while the French are not my most favorite people, currently, they did have a hell of a resistance movement going on during the occupation.

I doubt you'll understand the concept, as it probably conflicts with your "lay back and spread 'em" upbringing.

do you have no grasp of history whatsoever? if germany would have occupied us, we would have resisted, how in the fuck do you want us to resist something that never happened? holy shit you cannot be this stupid.

Instead you supplied them with metalworking they needed to maintain their war effort. You were helping them fight their war during the Nazi regime, why would they invade and look a gift horse in the mouth?

Would you give supplies to OBL if it meant not getting terrorist attacks on your soil?

As most any WW2 history buff will agree, the Flak 88's made by Sweden was probably one of the finest, most lethal conventional weapons of the war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/88_mm_gun

German planners instead developed more powerful guns with high muzzle velocity to reach high altitude, and much faster rates of fire. As Germany had been forbidden to produce new weapons of almost every sort after World War I, the German Krupp company developed the new guns in partnership with Bofors of Sweden. The original design that led to the 88 was a 75 mm model. During the prototype phase, the army asked for a gun with considerably greater capability than the 75. The designers started over, using another common German calibre, 88 mm.

We appreciate your country's contribution to that.

do you have no grasp of history whatsoever? if germany would have occupied us, we would have resisted, how in the fuck do you want us to resist something that never happened? holy shit you cannot be this stupid.

You are one dumb s.o.b....Do you think Germany would have stayed away from the oh so great Sweden had you not supplied them with war tools? They would have invaded and forced you into submission to make it for them, and then you could have shown the world how superior you really are by resisting and fighting. One of those other tough concepts to GRASP for you smart guy.

Painting Wiggo/Sweden as Nazi sympathizers isn't very productive, however dingbatty his assertions. WW2 produced plenty of compromised societies and Finlandization (not to mention social and religious entities), and we have the advantage of hindsight. That Sweden lacks a reason to invest in a bloated, US-like level of defense spending is simple geopolitical reality. They have better ways to spend their money, such as in the production of more Swedish women. Should we castigate Luxembourg for not advancing a missile system, Belgium for not investing in a Beer Production Defense Force, Latveria for disarming its weapons systems under the leadership of the pansyfist Fantastic Four?

I want to volunteer for the Beer Production Defense Force.

Ahh kill the Germans, much like we did? Thats right, once a pussy, always a pussy.
I guess we have to thank the japaneses (http://ayonae.ro/showthread.php?t=10118) then. ;)

As most any WW2 history buff will agree, the Flak 88's made by Sweden was probably one of the finest, most lethal conventional weapons of the war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/88_mm_gun



We appreciate your country's contribution to that.


Well lest we forget that every US naval ship also bristled with anti-aircraft guns courtesy of Bofors. The 40 mm Bofors probably had a lot to do with our success in the pacific.

So you guys want to castrate Sweden, but Japanese peeps are cool... Love the Logic on Ayonae ro forums :)

We are only showing your cohort in crime, Wiggo, that his perfect view of Sweden is glairingly inaccurate.
It's no different than when we have to inject a bit of reality into your myopic view of Iran.

If someone came on the boards claiming Japan was a peaceful nation, and everything done in its past was misinterperted, we'd lay the lumber on them as well.

because we really had the military power to invade germany? wtf are you smoking dude?
Of course you didn't. Thank fucking God that we did.

Thormir the point is that Sweden made a choice. They have the money to have the level of social services they do because the don't spend it on their military. When Hitler was knocking on their door they had to aid Germany to save their own hides. When Iraq invaded Kuwait they had to pretend it wasn't happening because they couldn't do anything. They were quite absent in Bosnia. They will probably call in sick for Darfur. They have to selfishly preserve their social services instead of helping those in need outside and thankfully they can because countries like Britain and the United States can do it for them.

But how dare Wiggo get so indignant about their better quality of life and how we don't contribute enough when their place at the table is so conspiciously absent when the opportunities to really help arise.

Kel, you say "to save their own hides" like it's somehow insulting. I doubt that Sweden pretended the Kuwait invasion wasn't happening; they, like many other countries, just don't project much power. Bosnia wasn't in need of support, and we're not in Darfur either despite the atrocities there, nor Burma. I don't blame Sweden for "selfishly preserving their social services" rather than generously launching invasions of countries that haven't attacked them. Military intervention abroad isn't some automatic good, and a lack of such undertakings isn't an automatic evil.

Or maybe we should nuke the Swiss.

This is entirely aside from Wiggo's goofball arguments about who donates more per capita being a measure of national worth. But note that the fact that Sweden does donate some considerable amount of funding qualifies perfectly well as "helping those in need outside."

But note that the fact that Sweden does donate some considerable amount of funding qualifies perfectly well as "helping those in need outside."

Ahh, so that's what supplying the Nazi war effort was called?
Or would have been called, if they had won.

You can't deny that if they had to project anything outside of a token contribution to the UN, their Social Democratic Utopia would be in tatters.

Military intervention abroad isn't some automatic good, and a lack of such undertakings isn't an automatic evil.
While a true statement, conversely, throwing money at a situation that requires a military presence is rarely a winning tactic.

we, along with the other scandinavian countries, provide a large part of the UN peacekeeping missions around the world (for example in post-war bosnia, kelraz, since you said we were absent).

but since we are officially neutral, why would we help NATO invade other countries, which we have no business invading?

Ahh, so that's what supplying the Nazi war effort was called?They must have learned it from the slaughter/relocation of American Indians. It's easy to find a time in a country's history that they won't be proud of, but that sort of tactic easily bites you in the ass.
While a true statement, conversely, throwing money at a situation that requires a military presence is rarely a winning tactic.While a true statement, obvoconversocontrarily, throwing military at a situation that requires money is rarely a winning tactic. Much like with using tautologies to illustrate a point.

Conveniently, situations that do require the military typically require money, and vice versa to a point.

I think this all goes back to what many of us feel as an outsider trying to insult our country.

I can insult my wife and my mother all I want too, but the moment someone else does, they are getting a fist to the face.

All the Americans on this board have insulted our country at one point or another, but we take offense when someone from another country insults America. We take even more offense when those insults aren't based on facts.

I fully agree, Tal. I just think a lot of the counter-arguments are irrelevent or just bad. Defending US philanthropy by invoking Sweden's WW2 activities isn't much more effective than calling people retards.

i was never trying to insult your country, i merely think all of the countries who promised to give (i think) 1% of their gdp in foreign aid should actually follow through with their promise.

LOL, "obvoconversocontrarily". Now there's a word you can be proud of!

I agree with the "attacking outsider" observation.
Americans generally relish the opportunity to verbally lambast each other over a variety of subjects.
However, when someone from another country wants to start in on how bad of a country the United States is, we circle the wagons.

This also happened in the wake of 9/11, once it was determined the attacks weren't some sort of horrible accident.

It's sad to think it takes that sort of event to band us together.

If you've never read "The Watchmen" by DC comics, it illustrates this to a tee.

It also doesn't help that the attacks come from an uneducated Euro-muppet.
Go back to Sesame Street, ya freak!

It also doesn't help that the attacks come from an uneducated Euro-muppet.
Go back to Sesame Street, ya freak!

oh sweet golden irony.

Does anyone realize how crazy it is to go after a country based on something that happened over 60 years ago? Not one of us was alive and for quite a few of you your parents weren't even alive.

I'll go out on a limb here and make a bet that Sweden would have our backs if, let's say Russia or China pulled an attack on the US or any of our european allies.

To go after countries based on decisions their leaders made during World War II is tantamount to being simply nuts. Look at what happened in the Balkans when the serbs decided to reach back to things that happened during not only WWII but as far back as the 14th century.

Get a grip guys, I don't se where Wiggo was trashing the US, he was mainly pointing out that there might be a better way for us to do things. If we as a country are not open to constructive criticism then our end is truly near.

Sweden was not allied with Nazi Germany they were basically a neutral party to the war. In the early 40's Germany was an extremely powerful country and many leaders simply decided to not get their asses kicked and have retribution on their populace by the SS.

Look at any country that stood up to Nazi Germany...they took a pretty good beating until the US got involved and don't forget we were in our own internal battle of whether to go with an isolationist strategy or not. So most places felt on their own and did the prudent thing.

I was typing all of that on my cell phone so its possible its incoherant because I can only read 2-3 lines, but the point still is Wiggo has been on a high horse this entire time talking about how the US doesn't do enough compared to Sweden yet ...

Our foundation or corporate givings alone rival the international contributions of our government.

Our government's budget is nearly 50% military. Sweden's is not even close to that.

Our military is relied on throughout the world. We have close to 1,500,000 Active Duty members of our military. Sweden has 22,000 or about 1.5% of our military. Sweden has 1 person in the military for every 400 citizens. We have 1 in 66. Obviously our military expenses are greater at the cost of being able to protect our citizens AND THEIRS when the need arises. The last time the need arose they were caught with their pants down. (and then there was the tangent, for which I apologize, but we never had to continue selling materials and aiding our enemies because we have always had the means to protect ourselves -- that was the point I was attempting to make)

Then he went on to talk about their higher standard of living. Yet their average income is still below ours. The place we lack is the social services for the poor, which is in part heavily taxed by the steady increase in immigration into this country since 1990 - the majority of these coming from Mexico, China, Philippines, India, and South America. If Sweden took on an extra 15 million citizens every year (not to mention the number of illegal immigrants we take on).

I'm one of the first to point out this countries' flaws. But its most certainly not in the foreign aid department. When a few American companies like Microsoft, General Electric, Phillip Morris, Disney, and Lockheed Martin collectively give the equivalent to a country like Sweden, PLUS the international involvement of all of our other Foundations and Corporations, PLUS the international involvement of the US Red Cross and our military we are undeniably at the head of the pack.

I'll go out on a limb here and make a bet that Sweden would have our backs if, let's say Russia or China pulled an attack on the US or any of our european allies.
Considering that they're a neutral country, why would you think that?

Considering that they're a neutral country, why would you think that?

3 Reasons

1 ) Their peacekeeping missions have placed them clearly on the same "side" and interests as the US and EU.

2 ) During the Cold War Sweden was able to call up an military of 1,000,000 if needed to take on the Soviets not to take on NATO.

3 ) Swedish people don't like Chinese food.

Countries don't do military things because it's the "right" thing to do. Countries do military things for purely selfish reasons. The US and Sweden both did what they thought were in the best interest of their countries.

We had to be dragged kicking and screaming into WW2... Sweden went neutral. Seems like the smart thing to do at the time.

But don't think Sweden will 'have our backs' just because. They'll do what they think is best for themselves, just like we will.

Get a grip guys, I don't se where Wiggo was trashing the US, he was mainly pointing out that there might be a better way for us to do things. If we as a country are not open to constructive criticism then our end is truly near.
.

Wiggo was attacking people on this board about how the US doesn't give ENOUGH, all the while most people pointed out exactly what we do give...its not all about the money. He had no constructive criticism, all he has was bashing.

Wiggo was attacking people on this board about how the US doesn't give ENOUGH, all the while most people pointed out exactly what we do give...its not all about the money. He had no constructive criticism, all he has was bashing.

I'd like to see a post where he attacked us based on what the US gave... He simply corrected an incorrect statement, and was insulted and bashed verbally for it.

He didn't give corrected information though. In both links he posted, they had differing data for the same year. You can't say he corrected anything when the data he posted isn't even consistant on it's own.

He didn't give corrected information though. In both links he posted, they had differing data for the same year. You can't say he corrected anything when the data he posted isn't even consistant on it's own.

Well shit, then tell him he was wrong and prove it... don't resort to insulting him.

And seriously, these BS anonymous neg rep hits are getting hilarious... Keep it up

Where did I specifically insult him? If you go through this thread, you can read where I DID point out inaccuracies.

Where did I specifically insult him? If you go through this thread, you can read where I DID point out inaccuracies.

Taleren, once again i was not speaking about you directly, but everyone who responded negatively in this thread.

Taleren, once again i was not speaking about you directly, but everyone who responded negatively in this thread.

You quote me. Then the first line you write immediately after quoting me was that I needed to prove him wrong, and not resort to insults. If you meant it to the thread and not to me, than why quote me and say that immediately after the quote? Don't you see the fault/error in that if you weren't directly speaking to me?

Generally if you quote someone, then immediately after that quote say something, it's in response to what you just quoted. If there were people in the thread you were directing that comment at, wouldn't it be more effective to quote that person?

You quote me. Then the first line you write immediately after quoting me was that I needed to prove him wrong, and not resort to insults. If you meant it to the thread and not to me, than why quote me and say that immediately after the quote? Don't you see the fault/error in that if you weren't directly speaking to me?

Generally if you quote someone, then immediately after that quote say something, it's in response to what you just quoted. If there were people in the thread you were directing that comment at, wouldn't it be more effective to quote that person?

Because you were defending those who insulted him by saying that he was wrong and basically saying that it was acceptable because of this...

Show me one word where I defended them. I said he posted inaccuracies, and that I pointed those out earlier in the thread, just like you asked.

Are you being purposefully obtuse to try to bait me?

I did say a few posts earlier that when someone bad mouths something/someone that a person is close too that a person is going to defend it and not necessarily be nice about it. Saying we don't give as much as we should and then quote inconsistant data as a be all end all, and then attempt to state we aren't as effective because we dont' have one culture, etc, he was badmouthing our country.

He's discussed in the past making generalizations about the US based upon the religious right. He's made generalizations about US intelligence (not the CIA, but the intelligence of the citizens). He's made assumptions about our entire society based upon pro-lifers. All things he's done for YEARS on this board. Of course when he states we aren't charitable enough when he completely ignores private and corporate donations, people are going to get up in arms about it.

Show me one word where I defended them. I said he posted inaccuracies, and that I pointed those out earlier in the thread, just like you asked.

Are you being purposefully obtuse to try to bait me?

I did say a few posts earlier that when someone bad mouths something/someone that a person is close too that a person is going to defend it and not necessarily be nice about it. Saying we don't give as much as we should and then quote inconsistant data as a be all end all, and then attempt to state we aren't as effective because we dont' have one culture, etc, he was badmouthing our country.

He's discussed in the past making generalizations about the US based upon the religious right. He's made generalizations about US intelligence (not the CIA, but the intelligence of the citizens). He's made assumptions about our entire society based upon pro-lifers. All things he's done for YEARS on this board. Of course when he states we aren't charitable enough when he completely ignores private and corporate donations, people are going to get up in arms about it.

Listen you are taking this way to seriously... When i responded to another quote with the objection of the insults being thrown at him, you responded to me, explaining how his facts were inaccurate.

Therefore i responded to your quote, yet I was still directing most of it towards the other posters. If you do not wish to discuss the insults, then don't respond to me about the validity of the content in his post, when my response was in regards to the treatment he recieved for posting.

People should be used to it here however, You guys talk about how outside criticism rallies Americans together to belittle and shut the person up, yet you act the same way with me and I am an American. So that argument doesn't fly.

If you don't like what he posted then tell him he is wrong, but what the hell is up with all the insults. You guys need to reevaluate your behavior towards others.

How about this, quit quoting my posts and then responding to other people if it's not me you have the beef with. It's asinine for you to keep quoting me, and then try to turn it around and state that you weren't talking to me.

His data was inaccurate period. You said in your post earlier to attack his data if it's inaccurate, which I had done several pages earlier in the thread. A fact you seem to have skirted over or conveniently ignored. Pointing out that his data is inconsistant between two links he made is NOT belittling him or telling him to shut up.

I have never belittled you for your Iranian heritage, and I'm not one of the people that's told you to go back to Iran for having an opinion/value system different than other posters here. You are now seemingly attacking me for no other reason than you are not receiving the responses from other people that you would like.

If you can't understand why quoting me, and then attributing things to me(or your posts inferring that I've said certain things), than you are the one with the issues here. Of course I am taking it seriously when you misattribute comments to me that I never said. You complain about the media in this country all the time, but you are doing exactly to me what you complain about the media doing.

There's only been one thing I've said to Wiggo in this thread that was remotely baiting him (the comment on whether he'd give supplies to OBL if he knew that would prevent a terrorist attack on his soil).

The point is, you told people to address what he said, and I did. I also had responded in the same fashion much earlier in the thread (a fact which you seem to continue glossing over). I address it, in a way that speficially addresses what you asked people on the board to address, and you say that is me badmouthing him or tacitly approving of people on this board that can't have an argument without throwing immature insults around.

If you don't like what he posted then tell him he is wrong, but what the hell is up with all the insults.
I did tell him he was wrong. I said why he was wrong. I said how the data was inaccurate. I didn't insult him. Nice try though.

You guys need to reevaluate your behavior towards others.
You mean like you trying to put words in my mouth and trying to troll to get a response out of me when I wasn't even party to the behaviour you are concerned with? Or do you mean more like telling someone that you are going to fuck our women and shit? Is that the proper way to treat people too?

Hypocrite.

If you don't like what he posted then tell him he is wrong, but what the hell is up with all the insults. You guys need to reevaluate your behavior towards others.

http://www.ayonae.ro/showpost.php?p=130489&postcount=78
The first insult on the topic, didn't go at Wiggo but from Wiggo:

are you fucking retarded? russia china india indonesia brazil pakistan bangladesh russia and nigeria dont give more because THEY ARE POOR. holy shit, you say i bad mouth the US when i was simply stating facts, then ask why the 100+ poor countries out there dont give out measurable aid, hint: they are the ones receiving aid right now.

by god, whining that bangladesh doesnt fork over the aid, boggles the mind.

That was shortly before you called all of the posters here "brainwashed lemmings".

How about this, quit quoting my posts and then responding to other people if it's not me you have the beef with. It's asinine for you to keep quoting me, and then try to turn it around and state that you weren't talking to me.

His data was inaccurate period. You said in your post earlier to attack his data if it's inaccurate, which I had done several pages earlier in the thread. A fact you seem to have skirted over or conveniently ignored. Pointing out that his data is inconsistant between two links he made is NOT belittling him or telling him to shut up.

I have never belittled you for your Iranian heritage, and I'm not one of the people that's told you to go back to Iran for having an opinion/value system different than other posters here. You are now seemingly attacking me for no other reason than you are not receiving the responses from other people that you would like.

If you can't understand why quoting me, and then attributing things to me(or your posts inferring that I've said certain things), than you are the one with the issues here. Of course I am taking it seriously when you misattribute comments to me that I never said. You complain about the media in this country all the time, but you are doing exactly to me what you complain about the media doing.

There's only been one thing I've said to Wiggo in this thread that was remotely baiting him (the comment on whether he'd give supplies to OBL if he knew that would prevent a terrorist attack on his soil).

The point is, you told people to address what he said, and I did. I also had responded in the same fashion much earlier in the thread (a fact which you seem to continue glossing over). I address it, in a way that speficially addresses what you asked people on the board to address, and you say that is me badmouthing him or tacitly approving of people on this board that can't have an argument without throwing immature insults around.


I did tell him he was wrong. I said why he was wrong. I said how the data was inaccurate. I didn't insult him. Nice try though.


You mean like you trying to put words in my mouth and trying to troll to get a response out of me when I wasn't even party to the behaviour you are concerned with? Or do you mean more like telling someone that you are going to fuck our women and shit? Is that the proper way to treat people too?

Hypocrite.

Where to begin...

First of all, you apparently just do not understand one bit why i quoted you and responded how i did, but i will explain one last time. I responded to a post in which i quoted someone else and you responded to me... So i quoted you since you obviously were attempting to make a point as to why he was being insulted, and i responded that it didn't matter and the insults were unwarranted.

Stop taking it seriously, I put 0 words in your mouth and i respect most of your posts. I did not intend to upset you, and if i did i apologize. But wait one second before you call me a hypocrite.

I endure insults from every side, in every response, every second that i spend posting and reading the forums here. I send 1 private message in anger to Fandros and now I am a hypocrite?

What kind of logic is this? I am constantly belittled and bashed on these forums for my opinion. Hell fuckin yea i am gonna get mad and respond. I try my best to ignore and respond with my next argument or defense for my opinion and am met with more bullshit insults.

How can you sit with a straight face and think of me as a hypocrite for getting mad and responding... IN A PRIVATE MESSAGE NONETHELESS!!!..

Bottom line is this Taleren, I did not mean to upset you with my post, I was simply angered at the rediculous ganging up on wiggo as i deal with it fucking daily, and wanted to throw him some backup at least in the form of condemning people for insulting him. Sorry if I offended you in the process.

And in Response to Kelraz. I did look back, and you are correct that Wiggo was responsible for the first Insult, I will not argue that he was correct for doing so. However can we atleast try and stay civilized on the forums? I know its easy to just act like douches because we are behind computer screens and can't see each other, but for real. This has become so childish.

I haven't been lobbing insults, I haven't lobbed insults at you. I don't give a rats ass what other people have said to you. Those things have absolutely zero to do with me. For you to keep bringing those up when addressing me is just stupid as those beefs have nothing to do with me. If you want to address things I say, try to stay on topic.

Trying to group me with every other poster, when I haven't been slinging insults doesn't fly.

You are damn right you've pissed me off. I've rewritten so many posts in responses to you before because in most cases I try not to levy personal insults in a post (sure i've been guilty of it too, but I haven't been calling people out for it). I know I haven't made slurs against your heritage, and I haven't even levied tirades on Iran.

The fact you are grouping me with people that sling insults at you here when I haven't is the same as me trying to group you with every terrorist that has some of the same ideology as you even though you haven't acted like they have. If you cannot understand that, you have the problem.

Yes I called you a hypocrite because you state over and over again not to personally attack people. Yes you responded to goading from Fandros, but you also did it in bigoted and hateful ways (and that's why I'm calling you a hypocrite because you complain when anyone does that to you).

I haven't been lobbing insults, I haven't lobbed insults at you. I don't give a rats ass what other people have said to you. Those things have absolutely zero to do with me. For you to keep bringing those up when addressing me is just stupid as those beefs have nothing to do with me. If you want to address things I say, try to stay on topic.

Trying to group me with every other poster, when I haven't been slinging insults doesn't fly.

You are damn right you've pissed me off. I've rewritten so many posts in responses to you before because in most cases I try not to levy personal insults in a post (sure i've been guilty of it too, but I haven't been calling people out for it). I know I haven't made slurs against your heritage, and I haven't even levied tirades on Iran.

The fact you are grouping me with people that sling insults at you here when I haven't is the same as me trying to group you with every terrorist that has some of the same ideology as you even though you haven't acted like they have. If you cannot understand that, you have the problem.

Yes I called you a hypocrite because you state over and over again not to personally attack people. Yes you responded to goading from Fandros, but you also did it in bigoted and hateful ways (and that's why I'm calling you a hypocrite because you complain when anyone does that to you).

Well then we can just agree to disagree. I don't think i should have to make 15 posts to respond to 15 people, I like to group all my responses into as little posts as possible, and you find it offensive because you feel that i connected you to others when it was not my intention. Like i said, I apologize if i upset you with my response.

I dunno, wouldn't it at least make sense to, I don't know, start a new paragraph if you are addressing someone else, or maybe a name? Doesn't have to be a new post per se; different train of thought I would hope at least though.

I still say quoting me, and then starting one paragraph that's basically nothing but a tirade you say is against others, only looks like you are addressing me from this side of the screen.

I can believe you that maybe that wasn't your intention, and accept the apology.

I will attempt to make it more easy to distinguish who i am replying to in the future :)

I was derailing from the derail that previously derailed the other derail!!:eek:

Anyhow...Try this one...it rocks!

Broiled Salmon with AB's Spice Pomade
1/3 cup canola oil, plus 2 teaspoons for sheet pan
1 side of salmon (approximately 3 pounds), pin bones removed
1 1/2 teaspoons kosher salt
1 teaspoon fresh ground black pepper
1 tablespoon whole coriander, toasted
1 tablespoon whole fennel seed, toasted
1 teaspoon whole cumin seed, toasted
1 whole star anise pod
2 teaspoons onion powder
1 teaspoon garlic powder
1/2 teaspoon cayenne pepper

Rub sheet pan with the 2 teaspoons of oil and place side of salmon in pan. Salt and pepper salmon. Set aside.

Add coriander, fennel seed, cumin seed, star anise, onion powder, garlic powder and cayenne pepper to a blender. Turn blender on high and process until whole spices become powder. With blender running, pour in 1/3 cup canola oil and blend until well combined. Stop blender to brush down sides of container, if necessary.

Brush salmon with spice mixture. Allow salmon to sit at room temperature for 30 minutes.

Preheat oven to the high broiler setting. Place salmon in the oven 6-inches from broiler. Cook until salmon reaches an internal temperature of 131 degrees F. This will take approximately 15 minutes, but will vary with different ovens. Remove from oven and let rest for 10 minutes, and then serve immediately. Note that the internal temperature of the fish will a rise a little as carry-over cooking occurs.

you should try Jansons Temptation instead, such a leet meal,

This simple and well tasting dish is suitable both for feasts and everyday meals.The only ingredient that may be slightly tricky to find is the Swedish anchovies. This version of anchovy is not as salty as the ones that are sometimes used on pizza. Try IKEA's food corner. They carry these items world wide! For 4 portions you need: 8 - 10 large potatoes; 2 medium onions; 20 anchovy filets (2 cans, 100 g each); 3 dl whipping cream; bread crumbs; 1 - 2 tablespoons of butter or margarine.

Preparing:

Set the oven for 200 - 225°C. Peel the potatoes and the onions. Slice the onions thinly and the potatoes into thin sticks, roughly 0,5 cm x 0,5 cm. (a food processor can be a handy help here!) Wash the potato strips in cold water and let them drain.

Grease a large ovenproof dish. Place a few layers of potato strips at the bottom of the dish. Next a layer of onion slices followed by a layer of anchovy. Keep layering until all the potatoes, onions and anshovy have been used up. Finish off with a potato layer.

Pour over half of the cream. Spread bread crumbs evenly on the surface. If you want to, you can put a few pats of butter on the top. Bake in the middle of the oven for about 45 minutes, until the potatoes have become soft. Pour over the remaining cream towards the end of the baking time. The Jansons's should now have a rich golden brown colour.

If you can't find anchovy filets for the Jansson's, you can try substituting with caviar. In this case use 3 - 4 tablespoons and mix in with the whipping cream.

Suggestions for serving

Jansson's Temptation is found on most Smörgårdsbord buffets around Christmas time. It is also a perfect late evening snack, which is referred to as a "vickning" in Sweden. A cold beer is a perfect complement for Jansson's Temptation.

you guys are a bunch of homo's cooking and all that shit.

I am just printing it out for my WIFE to do! :)

you guys are a bunch of homo's cooking and all that shit.

I am just printing it out for my WIFE to do! :)


I went to chef school following my military service, but dropped out midway through; I like cooking for small groups, not the large scale of the training.
But, being able to cook always was a plus with the ladies.....nothing beats the dessert after serving up some eggs benedict in bed for breakfast.


And Wiggo, or anyone else, can you give that whipping cream measure in cups or something? I am thinking you mean deca-liter with the dl, but not sure.
My mother loves anchovies, so I might surprise her with this, since she most likely had it as a child.

yes, its deciliters, no idea how much a cup is though (we actually used cooking cream, not whipped cream).

I am an idiot, another great thing from Sweden...Absolute Vodka!

I am an idiot, another great thing from Sweden...Absolute Vodka!

Absolut Citron and orange juice is a standard feature of my Sunday morning ritual, along with newspaper and rolls. :D

Absolut Citron and orange juice is a standard feature of my Sunday morning ritual, along with newspaper and rolls. :D

So when can I come over for Sunday breakfast?

yes, its deciliters, no idea how much a cup is though (we actually used cooking cream, not whipped cream).

OK, 32 fl ounces = 1 quart which equals one liter. So I am figuring that a dl would be 3.2 ounces, approx. This will be a fun trial and error cooking lesson.
I am figuring just over 1/2 pint of cream. :rolleyes:

BTW, bake covered or uncovered?

uncovered, ~200 degrees celsius for 45 minutes etc etc.

uncovered, ~200 degrees celsius for 45 minutes etc etc.


LOL, I was mentioning this to my niece, and my mother overheard me, and she said, "anchovies and potatos and onions, you must be talking about Jansen's Delight!". She then brought out a book of old Swedish recipes, and there it was, along with Sillsgraten, which is basically the same thing but with herring instead.

Was very funny afternoon talking old Swedish dishes.

She also was amazed that I could be conversing with someone in Sweden without even knowing them. She is not into putes or the internet, thank God, or Ups would have a single driver route for her house.

who the hell translated jansson to jansen? jansen sounds so...danish =(

who the hell translated jansson to jansen? jansen sounds so...danish =(

My bad, just spelled quickly rather than accurately.