http://www.nextenergynews.com/news1/next-energy-news2.13s.html

America is sitting on top of a super massive 200 billion barrel Oil Field that could potentially make America Energy Independent and until now has largely gone unnoticed. Thanks to new technology the Bakken Formation in North Dakota could boost America’s Oil reserves by an incredible 10 times, giving western economies the trump card against OPEC’s short squeeze on oil supply and making Iranian and Venezuelan threats of disrupted supply irrelevant.

In the next 30 days the USGS (U.S. Geological Survey) will release a new report giving an accurate resource assessment of the Bakken Oil Formation that covers North Dakota and portions of South Dakota and Montana.

I wonder what new 'endangered' species it'll be this time that keeps us from drilling it.

Wasn't the problem with that field being it was cost-prohibitive to extract? I thought it was discussed once before, and it was one of those fields where they would have to go in horizontally, or something, to be able to get at it?

That, or was the shale type field where the oil would have to be extracted from the crushed rock, or some such. (Shows my extensive knowledge of the oil biz)

But I swear we had that field mentioned before in the past year.

Probably not bad memory, but from the portion I quoted, there is "new technology" involved. I remember Canada and Colorado have huge amounts of shell oil available, but oil would have to get around $150 / barrell to be worth extracting.

No details of course on this new technology. Maybe they're just drilling deeper or something.

I have another thread to post about other new technologies we have at hand, but I don't want to derail this one just yet :)

but oil would have to get around $150 / barrell to be worth extracting.


That shouldn't be a problem, we just need to elect more people with ties to oil companies and soon they will ensure that prices rise even more.

there is "new technology"

Man our Chinese and Indian overlord's are really on the ball these days! This will go along ways to keeping the Coal trucks and Tata's on the road for some time.

Seriously, I hope the U.S. plays this more as an ace up our sleeves discovery than a lets run out drill tomorrow scenario and continue to push the Green fuels and technologies. non-Ethanol of course.

I'm not Naive enough to think we can pull the Oil needle out of our arms tomorrow but think we really need to start building the Tow-Truck that can right now.

And to add little perspective, these comments come from a guy who, pre PC/MMO days spent alot of time turning a wrench and working on my cars.
Personal favorite bieng the Purple 71" Maverick with the Cragers and 50's on the rear.

Purple 71" Maverick with the Cragers and 50's on the rear

My first car was a 64 1/2 Mustang with a 200 ci straight six, I gave it away to a friend of mine. I also had a '70 Olds 442 Convertible which I sold for $700.00 so I could buy a '73 Monte Carlo (how retarded was that)

I actually found my 442 and I'm seriously considering making the guy an offer for it.

/derail off

Ill pull up the link but Exxan CEo said last week he wasnt persuing anymore oil production to keep profits inline. Since converting oil to gas wasnt profitable anymore,.

Damn (http://pubs.usgs.gov/fs/2008/3021/).

3.65 billion < 200 billion barrels, but much more than was estimated last time (160 million).

A longer article (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/11/us/11oil.html) at the NYT. Some notes:
The area, known as the Bakken Formation, might contain 3 billion to 4.3 billion barrels of oil that could be extracted using current technology, the survey said.
...
The United States uses about seven billion barrels of oil a year.
...
The Bakken Formation is the largest oil resource ever assessed by the agency in which the oil is dispersed throughout the rock instead of sitting in separate places. Known as “continuous” oil accumulation, this type of distribution makes the oil harder and more expensive to extract.

Mr. Pollastro estimates that it would take tens of thousands of wells to extract the oil.

That number about what could be extracted is usually misleading.

There are billions of barrels around the world in fields that have been abandoned, because it takes a lot more energy to get the last half of the oil out. At some point between (usually) 1/2 and 1/4 remaining, it takes more energy to get the oil out than the oil could potentially produce. So, it makes no sense to continue and they leave it.

Still nice to find anything not in the Middle East though.

So it begs to wonder if this oil field exists, are there more? Recently I was having a chat with someone who jokingly stated that the US doesn't want to extract oil from itself so that when the Middle East dries up (albeit years and years into the future) we'd have a foothold in the business. It's a fun thought but whether it's valid is another question. I wonder if much is spent in the way of looking for new fields in our country? Other than AWAR and this I have no clue what exists.

Well, you do have to consider that eventually the oil WILL run out. From the articles i've read, alot of these middle eastern countries and others aren't really worrying or preparing for that eventuality. Will be kind of hard to go back to a pre-oil state of living imho.

Dubai is preparing very well for the inevitability of their oil running out. Instead of being an oil driven economy, they will attempt to be a tourism driven economy.

We need more pondscum (http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/tech/2008/03/25/obrien.pond.scum.fuel.cnn?iref=videosearch).

We need more pondscum (http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/tech/2008/03/25/obrien.pond.scum.fuel.cnn?iref=videosearch).


LOL, I was expecting something about Cheney.

Thats a really neat idea actually.

Dubai is already known for tourist appeal. It's a major hotspot for the very wealthy. They have some of the coolest looking hotels in the world. One of our support guys from Cerner Corp. has to go there like every 3x a year he always has some neat stories and photos. I wish I were rich :(

My understanding is that with the tech advances as long as oil remains above $50 dollars a barrel it's a viable resource.

The internal combustion engine needs to be replaced.

Well, you do have to consider that eventually the oil WILL run out.

At some point between (usually) 1/2 and 1/4 remaining, it takes more energy to get the oil out than the oil could potentially produce. So, it makes no sense to continue and they leave it.

The problem isn't running out of oil. The problem is getting to the point where nobody will be able to afford the extracted oil.

Imagine a 200$ oil barrel. Ok you won't take your car anymore.
Imagine a 300$ oil barrel. Or imagine bike backside transportation system for the same effect.

I posted sometimes ago a link to the catastrophic scenario of oil peak reached, where our world collapses.
I am an optimistic kind of guy, and that eventually we will find new energies for "common" living, but I have a hard time forseeing the "business sphere" surviving oil running out.

We have to find something. Soon.

signs are good toward alternative fuels. Isnt Brazil practically ethonol converted?

Ethanol isn't a good long term alternative, unless starvation/higher food prices is considered an acceptable trade off. Even if food products aren't used to create the ethanol, the land used for growing the product to make the ethanol is taking up valuable farmland.

The algae model shows huge promise. Undeniably the energy source which created (or rather still creates) all of our current energy sources eons ago was solar. It's the only "free" source we know we'll always have to capture... we just need to figure out how to cost effectively.

However, the idea of an algae plant seems flawed compared to algae kits. If everyone could set a series of those bags or tubes on their rooftop they would be able to make enough biodiesel in the summer to power their car through the winter and no shipping (and thus using / wasting more energy) wouldn't be needed.

Yeah I saw something on the algae last week that was very interesting.

Older article from Popular Mechanics (which along with Popular Science are muh fav mags) from March of 2007 but it provides some of the basics involving alternative energy provided by algae.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/earth/4213775.html

I'm sure the science and updates involving this are more current than this but thought I'd throw it out as a quick reference.

Ethanol isn't a good long term alternative, unless starvation/higher food prices is considered an acceptable trade off.Ethanol from corn is bad, but converting waste into ethanol can be done efficently. I really do need to dig up some articles I've read about the advances in this technology. And what's even better, Ford and GM are ahead of the world with the technology needed to use it.

OK, here is some of it:

http://www.motortrend.com/auto_shows/coverage/detroit/112_0801_general_motors_ethanol/

Today at the North American International Auto Show, GM announced it has taken a non-controlling equity interest in biology-based renewable energy firm Coskata Inc. The greater-Chicago-based company simultaneously announced that it has developed a proprietary process for converting renewable carbon-rich materials ranging from cornstalks and woodchips to old tires and city trash into clean-burning ethanol at a cost of roughly $1/gallon. A pilot operation will be up and running at Coskata's R&D headquarters in Warrenville, IL by the end of January, 2008, and a 40,000-gallon commercial demonstration facility under construction at an as yet undisclosed location will go online by the end of the year. General Motors will purchase much of the ethanol produced by this plant for use in the test vehicles at its Milford, MI proving ground. And plans are in the works for a 100-million-gallon/year facility to be up and running by 2011.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/automotive_news/4244643.html?series=47

Simply put, the Coskata process can produce ethanol almost anywhere in the world, using practically any renewable source, including feedstock, garbage, old tires and plant waste. And it can do so for less than a dollar per gallon.

And GM and Ford can use this fuel for about $100 added cost to a vehicle (flex fuel capable.) This is the type of thing that government would be good at, forcing this to happen. Bye bye OPEC's strangle-hold.

I hope we get on new technology in a serious way, because if we dont press and focus on it, we may find ourselves on the outside looking in.

China and India graduate more engineers each year than the US graduates people from college, total. If you think about the probability factor, the odds of the next Orville Wright, Thomas Edison, or Eli Whitney being American are greatly diminished just because of the pure numbers.

Will we continue to be the nation of innovation and discovery or will be cling to impossible task of trying to freeze time as it is now because we are too fat and too comfortable and unwilling to change things up.

I still think the most straightforward answer is nuclear power and electric cars (or cars that use the electricity indirectly, such as by carrying hydrogen that was generated by electrolysis). Bring back the Integral Fast Reactor (http://www.nuc.berkeley.edu/designs/ifr/anlw.html) program!

As much as possible, oil should be reserved for plastics and fertilizers and such.

Two words for everyone --- Mister Fusion.