No one seems to want to answer my question in a different thread so i thought I'd start a new thread. Did Radical get demoted? thats the word on teh grapevine.. so come on FOD inquiring minds wanna know!

What a cruel twist of fate if so...

(groan)

The word on the street is that if Radical wants to tell you he will. Otherwise you don't get the luxury of being privy :)

That's what FoD's memberbase has been told to the best of my knowledge as well :)

I figured there was a post on there boards to not take this subject out of guild but by the sound of your post he was demoted! JUSTICE SHALL PREVAIL! Even though i didnt agree with him he is still FOD's only way of progression.

That was bad Pali...:)

I try.

Seriously though, nothing says "Yes" quite like "No comment."

I figured there was a post on there boards to not take this subject out of guild but by the sound of your post he was demoted! JUSTICE SHALL PREVAIL! Even though i didnt agree with him he is still FOD's only way of progression

You're still pretty clueless. It was never a secret that he's not an officer, I just paraphrased the only officer comment on the subject at the time from the boards (albeit less eloquently). That radical hasn't posted here to let you and others know, and likely never will, confirms the fact that you aren't going to know the nature of his stepping down :)

Regardless of all that, FoD still has plenty of capable (if out of practice) officers who are gladly testing out the water, your last sentence sums up your ignorance quite nicely. Shame on you Shamzy.

yep im ignorant oh hey have fun in plane of time.

ok but seriously the grapevine was saying that he was ousted because people were getting sick of his shady NBG (Who can suck up the most!) loot rules.

www.coldfury.com - Hi i'm grums

so so ignorant :(

that would be www.cold-fury.net rather

Officer awarded loot is clearly the best system for the "perfect" guild playing a "perfect"; one where everyone attents exactly the same number of raids, where raids always drop the same items (10 warriors, no problem, he'll drop 10 swords!), and where every member of the guild can completely see the whole of the guild as important beyond themselves.

It breaks down eventually for most other guilds :)

[Edit, insert GAME before the first semi-colon.] ...the "perfect" guild playing the "perfect" game...

The forums need a third option for edit -- "No edit, IF replies have been posted."

Officer awarded loot is clearly the best system for the "perfect" guild playing a "perfect"; one where everyone attents exactly the same number of raids, where raids always drop the same items (10 warriors, no problem, he'll drop 10 swords!), and where every member of the guild can completely see the whole of the guild as important beyond themselves.

It breaks down eventually for most other guilds :)

I take offense to that. Who are you to mock the way loot is distributed?

I take offense to that. Who are you to mock the way loot is distributed?

He is someone that handed out loot that very same way for years before we switched to DKP.

Not that I am defending him, just clarifying.

(maybe I am defending him? Christ, what has the world come to?)

Hi, Jacynthia. Thanks for writing me!

I'm not mocking officer-awarded "best choice for the guild as determined by committee" loot at all. I think it is, without a doubt, the best system for a guild that has (a) roughly equal playtime for all members, (b) little to no turnover in membership, (c) small guild size or highly repeatable content, (d) members who see share in the vision of the system, and (e) members who have faith in their leadship.

I probably distributed (or participated in the decision process for the distribution of) as much loot by officer-award as anyone still playing this game. Eventually though, every factor above turned us to a different system. Because, let me tell you brotha':

As award-based loot distribution increases in items, the probability of someone getting upset about it approaches one.

(You can call that Palimax' corollary to Goodwin's law...)

I have no freakin' clue what happened, is happening, or might happen in your or anyone elses guild with regard to loot or who's an officer today, yesterday or might be one tomorrow. I, honestly, don't much care. These, however, are discussion forums, and I've got a little something to say about award-based loot systems.

Rambing on...in Velious, for us, it was important - for the guild - to gear up a handful of tanks before other plate classes. Velious was realy the true dawn of the CH-rotation one-tank era. Getting the next tank agro wasn't quite so easy back then. You either kept the main tank up, or you risked wiping while you fumbled for agro with the #2 tank. So, we geared up tanks first, and the guild understood why. Eventually, the #3 tank, and the #6 cleric get a little tired of this plan though :) Paladins start to wonder if they'll ever get a piece of plate armor...good of the guild guys, suck it up.

Sure, times have changed, but people haven't that much. Eventually awarded loot causes problems for someone. If the guild is strong enough on my 5 points above, then, who cares. You give that person the 'ol heave-ho, and move on. If not, you find another solution to your problems.

But, what do I know.

Hi, Palimax. You're welcome!

By all means, you are entitled to your say. What I think got to me was your little "perfect game, perfect guild" quips. Dont think for a second that you know us, or how things are ran within the guild.

The loot system, however, works for us. And if it aint broke, dont fix it. I dont doubt that you know alot about loot distribution, nor do I care, but my initial comment was because you said that in the first place.

I have no beef with you, but if I read something that semi concerns me, and I take offense to it, Im not one to hold back and take it. I'll throw my say up in it.

Hi, Palimax. You're welcome!

By all means, you are entitled to your say. What I think got to me was your little "perfect game, perfect guild" quips. Dont think for a second that you know us, or how things are ran within the guild

I have no beef with you, but if I read something that semi concerns me, and I take offense to it, Im not one to hold back and take it. I'll throw my say up in it.


You might want to adjust the filters you are looking at things through, and maybe you will not take offense as often. If you are looking at the forum expecting to see snide remarks, you will surely find them; however, if you are looking at the threads to see what folks have to say, you may read folks giving examples and analogies that convey their point of view, without any hidden meaning.

And, for the record, we still are doing the same loot distribution in Elemental as we did in Velious, and that is NBG:cool: It works for us.

Amazing the things you can find if you're looking for them...

Heh...Pali handled loot distribution pretty good in Vision ( before VA, and with the exception of the mana robes =P ) ...
I have to admit, for the most part it was for the good of the guild to advance.

Though awarded loot gets skewed IMO when it comes to RL friends and family vs average guild members. BUT .... Seems if you spend 3 months in TIME, pretty much everyone gets what they want.

if you are looking at the threads to see what folks have to say, you may read folks giving examples and analogies that convey their point of view, without any hidden meaning.



Which was all I was doing, conveying my point of view. He didnt think anyone would respond... I responded. I said what I wanted to say.

FoD isn't pure NBG contrary to popular knowledge. For better or worse it's based first and foremost on "last recieved loot" date, secondly by the last three loot dates, and finally with *a general idea of their attendance* kept in mind to seperate people with similar loot dates. It gets a bit foggy around that stage, but very few people complain as the system is based on *figures*, not personal opinions. It's also done by majority officer vote, and 99% of the time all of the officers agree.

So "sucking up to radical for loot", while being an inguild joke, makes you look more ignorant than you looked before, little Shamzy :(

I've seen a couple of things that i thought were injustices, but you guys aren't going to know about those, either :)

I've seen a couple of things that i thought were injustices, but you guys aren't going to know about those, either :)

There is ALWAYS something like that in a NGB system. Long as you can accept that then everything will be fine.

So "sucking up to radical for loot", while being an inguild joke, makes you look more ignorant than you looked before, little Shamzy :(


And your right that INSIDE the guild looks that way but rest of the high end game is littered with people who have the same exact opinion. God half the people who leave your guild I bet had something against Radical and his STFU ttitude.

God half the people who leave your guild I bet had something against Radical and his STFU ttitude.


Hehehe, he is not much different than the Radical that romped in Blackburrow.
He has come a long way tho, and from all I hear many have him to thank for the strides they have made as well.

rest of the high end game is littered with people who have the same exact opinion

With ignorant people? I don't doubt it. It's based on opinion, not fact. Uninformed opinion at that.

your guild

I said before that i was Grums from Cold Fury now. You're not worth my time anymore.

And your right that INSIDE the guild looks that way but rest of the high end game is littered with people who have the same exact opinion. God half the people who leave your guild I bet had something against Radical and his STFU ttitude.

Apparently you do too? :confused: :D

Thought this would be a good place to put it -

"I said before that i was Grums from Cold Fury now." - Ebay, shame shame shame.

1 point negative rep ( - hmmm :) )

Jeebus Shamz, hate much?

I had a few beefs with the loot systems back when I was in FoD, but all in all, it fit the guild as well as any loot system fits any guild. The officers do a good job in working out who gets what, though I dont envy them that.

Hmm, maybe now I can get my $5 from Rad for that chest piece I never got!! :) Kidding, kidding, Rad, you can keep it :)

I just love how everything turns to loot.

Rad's guild status had nothing to do with loot. The reasons were personal and will not be shared in a public medium. They are between Rad, the people directly affected, and the Guild.

Seriously though, nothing says "Yes" quite like "No comment."

Or, could be I've been in upstate New York for the past 9 days for my brothers wedding. The ignorance in this thread has really given me a good laugh though, way to go guys.

Grums - shoot me a tell we never got to finish our chat the other night :)

This thread is awesome. It's like:

"Do you have herpes?"

"What makes you think that? I could have just gone to the doctor for a cold!"

There's an awful lot of Kevin Bacon, end of Animal House, "Remain Calm! All is well!" going on here :)

They are between Rad, the people directly affected, and the Guild.

Ah ha! a clue she said the people directly affected.....

A clue!! Maybe if we pieced them all together we would find out that it is really..OH MY GOD!! Radical, who is responsible for world hunger, pestilence and trailer park trash!! Burn him at the stake!!!

Better yet, it's all Carrot Tops fault.

A clue!

Shamzy and Scooby are on the case!

A Clue? Tell him what he's won Johnny!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v339/SarahER84/shutthefuckup.jpg

:rolleyes:

Oh man that image macro is classic and your execution was brilliant. What is next oh king of internet comedy

Oh man that image macro is classic and your execution was brilliant. What is next oh king of internet comedyMaybe the special olympics one, oh man, that's a real knee-slapper.

Oh man that image macro is classic and your execution was brilliant. What is next oh king of internet comedy

Made me laugh, so happy enough. :p

As a former loot distributer myself, all I can do is echo Pali's sentiments. Sooner or later as you grow or progress, someone is gonna get upset, and even if you are the familyest of family guilds, there is no fixing it, and it digs DEEP as people scramble to figure out priorities. It can land the loot czar in the boobie hatch.

I liked doing it when we started it, and most agreed I was fair. I absolutely hated it at the end and would not be playing today if we still did it that way. DKP isnt a dirty word if you put the effort in to making sure it matches the way you continue to play. Certainly there are still people who get upset at certain loots going one way or the other, but the bottom line is, you bid your points and you take your chances.

PS thumbs up for Radical, he has always been stand up in my book.

Kad

In our case, we avoid bidding as well. Fixed prices has its own set of woes, but it solves any sort of "Only bard at the raid gets the Uberhorn" problem, and eliminates collusion on class-based items.

/Palimax tells VANecro: Ok, it's my turn, nobody else bid on the NecroUberObject.

We do DKP on all raid items .. If no one bids we allow any alts on the raid to use their DKP points ( yes ALTS can earn DKP too ). If none of them want it, we allow open roll for anyones alts that can get to the item. Since we're not a time guild, usually works pretty well. If absolutely no one wants it, we give it to the Pallies ... since we all know they need every bit of Tribute they can get :cool: