Well they ended the strike, I assume the talk of jail time scared union officials. Be interested in some of our NYC people's take on the situation. Not sure if Briscoe or Garrath were affected or not.

Personally I don't like unions, in older days they were a necessity but now are almost as outdated as the Electoral College is. My grandfather owned a buisness in MA, and the unions forced him to close down, because he couldnt afford the constant legal fees associated with having union employees.

Saw an intresting study (obviously done by a anti-union writer) but the proof was in the pudding. An Ironworker union in Michigan raised their dues. Later in that year they negotiated via strike threat for a increase in pay. After tallying the increase in pay and then comparing it to the increased yearly dues, the ironworkers made $87 LESS annually. Go unions!

Personally I don't like unions, in older days they were a necessity but now are almost as outdated as the Electoral College is.



I agree with that totally! My dad drives a semi and basically is going to HAVE to join a Union in order to make any money for our family. He hates the idea, but he's doing what he has to.

It would be a lot easier to listen to people bash unions if they at least studied a bit of labor history first, to understand why unions came about, and what they have done on the behalf of the working class.

As one example, prior to the strike in the 70's organized by the mail carriers union, the average mail carrier was working a second job or getting food stamps to keep the family fed. As a result of the strike, wages and benefits were increased, along with the Postal Service becoming a self-supporting agency that no longer was supported with tax monies.

While I agree that there are many cases of abuse of the labor agreements by unions, those same agreements protect the worker in a number of ways. The sad fact is that unions are going the same way as many other remnants of the 20th century; (INCOMING BLANKET STATEMENT)today's generation sees anything they were/are not involved with as irrelevant to them, and therefore easily cast aside.

Go ahead and dislike unions, but at least do a bit of research on the history of unions so that you can have some respect for their place in the history of worker's rights, and the rise of the middle class (which is now sinking back down again as unions become obsolete).

As you see more and more jobs becoming part time (less than 40 hours per week) so that the employer can avoid paying benefits, and can more easily terminate the employees as they attain seniority, think about what an organized union movement may have been able to do to affect that company's practices.

There are pros and cons to unions. It is good to be able to see both sides.

Edit: BTW, that Ironworkers contract example is not a very good argument without also including how much the employee contribution to health insurance changed; that has been a standard tool used by many large employers the last several years, increasing employee contributions for health insurance coverage to offset any pay increases which essentially negates any additional expense to the employer.

As a union member, I LOVE union jobs over my non-unions jobs. For one, my day rate is a lot higher. Secondly, I know I am gonna eat. Often times on non-union jobs I'll go 10 hours without a meal. Thirdly, I know that I will actually get paid on time. Too many little people could still potentially get screwed if unions didn't exist, sad to say even on big projects for companies like Discovery Communications I have gotten stiffed a bit on an invoice, if it was a union project I'd never have that problem.

If you notice i did say there was a necessity at one point, but i feel that necessity is drawing nearer to an end.

I now live in Florida, where unions how almost no power, due to state laws. I know quite a few people who worked Union up north, came to florida, and in the end were happier, cause in the cases of the enviroment they live in here, the unions arent needed.

So like the electoral college i used above, it served a VERY important purpose. please note thepast tense of the word serve

As a union member, I LOVE union jobs over my non-unions jobs. For one, my day rate is a lot higher.

& that is why alot of plants close up shop. They can't be price competitive if they have to deal with a union. There is a 2.1 million sq foot tire plant here for Cooper tire. It used to be Firestone. Strikes and union demands broke the plant, yet it thrives now as a non union shop.

Hell, I worked there in IT. Those of us in support were treated like dirt compared to production because they didn't want a union coming in. I personally have seen tire builders sleeping in the break rooms 8 hours through their 12 hour shift. This was considered ok as long as they had made quota. It torqued me since my only chance at a bonus was tied to plant production. Their bonus was tied to the numbers they built. When they had built "enough" for the bonus they wanted, they just went and napped even though they were being payed an hourly rate as well for those last 4 hours of the shift.

Thing is, the employees at coopers non union plants make more than the ones at the union plants due to the bonuses offered. The union plants have a slightly higher hourly wage but none of the production incentives the non union plants have.

Those of you in the NJ/NY area may be familiar with the EZPass project for toll collection. Worldcom bid that 500 million dollar project based on a 2 year completion. Able telecom, a holding company that also owned the construction company I worked for at the time, bought the contract. I was sent up to review their completion rates and get a handle on the mess they had created with the software.

The union halls were telling their members to "make the project last 4 years". They inflated labor reports and purposely did things to stall the project. Oh, and the late fees were 35k per day. Able is now bankrupt, the project still isn't done, and a ton of taxpayers money is squandered.

Unions used to be, and in a few industries still are, necessary. For the most part, they aren't.

I know why they were around and they were needed then, but now they aren't needed so much.

I'm dealing with them first hand, I don't like it, my dad hates it. My grandpa and great grandpa were both in unions when they were needed, they helped our family. Sure they'll get us more money now, but at what cost? I know a lot of places my dad hauls for now can't afford to use union companies to haul their goods.

Like many things, corruption ftw