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View Full Version : Russia vs. Georgia vs. The Media


Sanchek
08-17-2008, 02:00 PM
Want to make people believe Russia was the aggressor and stir up American Russia hate that's been dormant too long? Stage some photos in Georgia!

http://www.popgive.com/2008/08/strange-things-at-reuters-photos-from.html

Remember when we used to point and laugh at how deluded Communist nations were by their media's propaganda? Where's Walter Cronkite when you need him?

Kelraz Bladesinger
08-17-2008, 02:19 PM
Its definately suspicious, but the last two look legitimate. One was shot wide angle, one was shot long lens. The wide angle compresses space considerably.

Sanchek
08-17-2008, 02:24 PM
Look at the area around the tear in his shirt, the pose of the "body", and and area around the white thing on the ground in the wider angle shot. He was definitely moved.

Rover
08-17-2008, 02:44 PM
I did see the first photo the day it was published and the caption did NOT read that Georgian soldiers move the dead body of a woman. It read that Georgian medical personal move a wounded women out of the area of an air strike.

Also the photo of the man crying was captioned that he was grieving his brothers death, also the dead body in the photo of the woman being moved is supposedly his dead brother, there were about 5-6 photos of the guy also holding his brothers body.

The image of the guy could most definately be taken there as it is an affect one gets with a "long lens" telephoto probably 200-300 mm where the background seems closer.

Also the piece of a telephone pole as proof?

The criteria that was used as faked photos is really thin.

Kelraz Bladesinger
08-17-2008, 04:12 PM
Sanchek, starting to post chain e-mails that should have been checked through Snopes first? You'll be the next Trikki! :D

(They might be staged, but I'm fairly certain the distance in the bottom two is just being changed with a telephoto lens vs a wide-angle lens and they are probably put out of order - the telephoto or 4th one was probably shot before the third. I do sound normally, but I've definitely seen my fair share of lenses.)

Sanchek
08-17-2008, 04:36 PM
Make sure you read the original source too (figured the short one would be better for iADD): http://www.byzantinesacredart.com/blog/2008/08/deceiving_the_world_with_pictu.html

I understand how a wide angle lens would change the background, but that doesn't explain all of the material differences between the two pictures (his shirt and post being different, and there being objects in the second that don't appear at all in the first).

akipt
08-17-2008, 06:45 PM
It wouldn't surprise me. Reuters... they're becoming known for doctoring war images.

Lleauric
08-17-2008, 08:56 PM
I dont think its Reuters doing some kind of intentional plot.

We live in a different world than we did 20 years ago. Technology has set the bar much lower for photographers. You dont need to have paid staff flown out to some warzone to get action shots. You can connect with locals and have them transmit the photos over the web.
http://www.reuters.com/youwitness

(Look at the "This Week In Photos". Some pretty bad ass pictures in there. BTW)

Are the standards much higher for their paid photographers? Instead of working with a steady stable of a 100 or so professionals that would make their living getting into the worst places on Earth and photographing it, the field has been so expanded that a news organization is dealing with 10s of thousands of people. Obviously when you use local people for the photographs, some are going to be heavily emotionally invested in the outcome of whats going on.

Its no secret that a photograph can change the world.

http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0309/images/life/VCexecute.jpg
http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0309/lm25.html
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x30/pinguy123/buchenwaldly8.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x30/pinguy123/tiananmensquarepm2.jpg
http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0309/lm10.html
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x30/pinguy123/1930lynchingtu3.jpg
http://z.hubpages.com/u/121204_f520.jpg
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x30/pinguy123/nilssonhz4.jpg
http://www.flatrock.org.nz/topics/odds_and_oddities/assets/wanting_a_meal.jpg
http://www.digitaljournalist.org/issue0309/lm18.html
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/21/Adams_The_Tetons_and_the_Snake_River.jpg/749px-Adams_The_Tetons_and_the_Snake_River.jpg
http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/2667880.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=6E41E83E90A345BD6031F697E73FDD5BA55A1E4F32AD3138
http://photo.pileofphotos.com/pics/pic_941502001182356560.jpg
http://neatorama.cachefly.net/images/2006-12/brady-federal-dead-battle-gettysburg.jpg
http://neatorama.cachefly.net/images/2006-12/gandhi-spinning-wheel.jpg

Rover
08-17-2008, 11:28 PM
L2 is right, anyone can become a published photographer or videographer in todays world.

Sanchek
08-17-2008, 11:54 PM
If a news service isn't accountable for the content they distribute, who is?

If any random photographer can get their staged work on Reuters and no one sees a problem with that, why in the world would we trust Reuters any more than this message board or any random blog on the Internet?

I agree that it almost certainly wasn't part of a plan hatched in a Reuters boardroom, but I can't agree with nonchalantly downplaying the deception.

Rover
08-18-2008, 12:29 AM
I don't mean to come off as nonchalantly playing down the deception. There is an obvious inherent danger in the world of instant news images, in particularly with still photos the problem is known as "photo shop" but on top of that problem lies the problem of the editor that is so focused on being the first to publish that they either intentionally overlook or are just not savvy enough to pick out the discrepencies in the photo.

Sadly the days of the "hero photographer" are gone, no more Capas, Burroughs, Adams or Leroys you don't need a Nikon or a Leica anymore when you can get the shot with your Samsung!

akipt
08-18-2008, 08:17 AM
Maybe Jedd and his pravda view were a little inaccurate.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/story/48860.html

TSKHINVALI, Georgia_ As Russian troops pounded through Georgia last week, the Kremlin and its allies repeatedly pointed to one justification above all others: The Georgian military had destroyed the city of Tskhinvali. Russian politicians and their partners in Tskhinvali, the capital of the breakaway region South Ossetia, said that when Georgian forces tried to seize control of the city and the surrounding area, the physical damage was comparable to Stalingrad and the killings similar to the Holocaust.

But a trip to the city on Sunday, without official escorts, revealed a very different picture. While it was clear there had been heavy fighting — missiles knocked holes in walls, and bombs tore away rooftops — almost all of the buildings seen in an afternoon driving around Tskhinvali were still standing.

Russian-backed leaders in South Ossetia have said that 2,100 people died in fighting in Tskhinvali and nearby villages. But a doctor at the city's main hospital, the only one open during the battles that began late on Aug. 7, said the facility recorded just 40 deaths.

The discrepancy between the numbers at Tskhinvali's main hospital and the rhetoric of Russian and South Ossetian leaders raises serious questions about the veracity of the Kremlin's version of events.

akipt
08-18-2008, 09:05 AM
More...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/georgia/2575214/Georgia-Russian-military-entrench-themselves-deeper.html

"Do you know what the Georgians did in Tskhinvali," demanded one fighter, who identified himself as Sulim. "They killed 2,000 people. Georgians were crushing small children with their tanks."

From the beginning of hostilities, officials in Moscow were quick to declare that "genocide" was taking place and that up to 2,000 people had been killed in attacks deliberately aimed at Tskhinvali's civilian population.


Vladimir Putin, the prime minister, went on television to claim that Georgian tanks were crushing children and Georgian soldiers were beheading civilians.


Yet the first independent human rights activists attempting to calculate the civilian death toll have so far only been able to confirm the deaths of 44 people according to records from Tskhinvali's only hospital.


According to Human Rights Watch, the respected New York-based body, the Kremlin's deliberate exaggeration of the civilian death toll was inevitably contributing to the scale of reprisals against Georgians.


Asked whether he had personally seen any children crushed by Georgian tanks, Sulim replied: "No, but I heard Putin say it so it must be true."

Russian propaganda has been so convincing that not even the few independent media outlets that normally criticise the Kremlin in Russia have spoken out against the Georgia war.

Sanchek
08-18-2008, 11:41 AM
Its no secret that a photograph can change the world.

Which is why it's so important that we at least give some scrutiny to the images that we allow to influence so many. Ex:

http://www.srpska-mreza.com/lm-f97/LM97_Bosnia.html

Bylimet Spiritwalker
08-18-2008, 06:31 PM
I bet Putin has been having multiple orgasms without even fondling himself.

akipt
08-18-2008, 06:35 PM
But that would require the use of .......... oh, nevermind.

Fandros
08-18-2008, 07:40 PM
Wow, who would've thought independent investigations would turn out showing Russia was lying.

If by now you still believe the entire S.O. situation wasn't staged or coerced by the Bear you really are oblivious.

akipt
08-20-2008, 08:30 PM
Russia is getting pwnd (http://www.luoamerican.com/baldilocks/2008/08/to-russia-with.html)in the new media.

Perhaps we could take up a donation here at Ayonae.com and send the Russian embassy all our old silverware?

Kelraz Bladesinger
08-21-2008, 10:25 AM
The embassy is probably still doing pretty good right now. The test will be what type of vodka shots they give out to the school children on Halloween. If its still a top shelf Russian Vodka like Jewel, then I'm sure they're in decent financial shape. If they drop it down to Stoli, they may be in trouble and need our help.